I just don't know anymore...
 

So the RNC went down and Ron Paul was kicked out (for being honest about his positions and his intent and not endorsing Romney) if the sources can be trusted.

But it's unsettling. A lot of people seem to think that just because this dude had some kind of consistency and he was anti-war and many were convinced that he was honest, they latched on to him like he was some kind of fucking messiah.

A couple of things that I've noticed about the US lately from all this hubbub crap.

It is clear that the US people are aching for a candidate that's honest and a straight shooter. I think the US people have accepted that their government is based on lies and deception and now you get this ONE extreme far right candidate who can give you a whole lot of truth and not apologize for his stances and people are ready to blow him.

So where are the honest candidates of the other side of the spectrum? Where is the honest Marxist or Communist candidate who would also not fold to Democrat or Republican demands? It's not that I'm saying there aren't any; it's just that I'm saying there doesn't seem to be many popular ones. Just recently I heard about Jill Stein and apparently we agree on a lot of issues. But I've never heard of this woman before until a couple of days ago.

So I guess I'm just wondering how an extreme right candidate like Ron Paul became so popular but there doesn't seem to be a popular leftist underdog.

I can't help but pull this every time or at least see the Ron Paul popularity in this way, but it seems like his fan base is essentially privileged middle class to upper class white males. Sometimes I think Ron Paul seems to resonate with the privileged youth and the poor who don't understand how our government works/is supposed to work for them.

I'm not really sure what I'm trying to say, but that I find the whole issue of what happened at the RNC and the cultrage of Ron Paul supporters to be disheartening.

What the hell is wrong with this country?

I like Stewart Alexander. Not that anyone outside the socialist party would know him, nor that even other leftist parties will vote for him.

So Saya and I have discussed getting G.net to pitch in on an unpopulated island that we all can live in peace on.

Sounds good to me

Eh hate to say it but there isn't a single island out there anymore that wouldn't fall under the domain of one government or another. Man made islands are out of the question too after they plugged the leak that allowed such man made island sovreign nations. I don't think they want a repeat of that man made nation off the coast of the UK.

One lottery winning dream I've shared with a few gnetters over IM is the idea of buying a lake here in Wisconsin and founding a town around it, with it's own industry. A goth town even. After all Wisconsin has alot of people here who like reinacting the victorian era way of life as it is. The town could make money building coffins and providing funeral services, with the companies being employee owned.

You guys are banalizing Ashley's thread.

Your face.

I agree with Alan, but I can understand the sentiment that the others are saying.

There does seem to be this overarching idea that there's no real escape or fixing the establishment so we tend to dream up ideas where we simply escape from established society and invent a new one.

I understand that, but I don't like it either.

You see, it's like those that support state's rights over human rights. They always tell me that I shouldn't care if Florida or Texas or any other state is horrible to its poor, it's PoCs, its immigrants, or its women; it doesn't affect me and wont because I live in New York in quite possibly one of the most progressive cities in the whole country. I have no reason to bitch; I'm unaffected.

Well excuse the shit out of me if I happen to give half a damn about fellow Americans or even human beings in general. So no. FUCK state's rights. There's a big big problem if you go from one state to another and all of a sudden; you're a different person under the law. That's fucked up shit, yo.

And then I wonder what the fuck is actually wrong with the GOP or even most Democratic candidates. All of them have seemed to have graduated from Ivy League schools and many of them actually have a problem with teaching children the theory of Evolution through natural selection or they even seem to lack even the most basic academic understanding of poverty. It's like they're not even book smart about it. Oh and THEN they can't seem to understand that if heterosexual people get tax breaks and benefits from marriage, that it's only fair to extend that to all orientations. Of course, what do you get if they want to talk about being fair? Stop extending the benefits to hetero couples or don't have the state recognize marriages at all regardless of orientation. In short, "I can't stand to see LGBTQ people enjoy the same rights that I enjoy under the law so much, that I'd rather do without the rights all together than to see them gain one OUNCE of social mobility." WHY WONT THESE PEOPLE FUCKING DIE ALREADY?!

I sit there and see the political discourse in the US right now and the shit is insanely vicious with plenty of racism, sexism, and even NAKED PROTECTION of certain privileges to certain classes of people in the US.

And then I have to wonder what the fuck it actually is that stays the hand of the American people when one of our candidates starts talking about how tough they're going to be on the poor or when they start boasting sexist jingoism right in front of level headed people. WHY AREN'T THEY GETTING SPAT UPON?!

And then I end up sympathizing with the "fuck it, I want to live on an island away from the crazy bullshit" crowd. Only problem is; turning your back on the world isn't going to solve the problems and "out of sight/out of mind" isn't a strategy.

And it's shit like this that reinforces my allegiance to communism and makes it easy for me to confirm that it's exactly a dose of that, that the US needs.

Not to deter the conversation back into a dreamy fantasy again. But, I always fantasized of forming an Island of scientists. Much like a real Rapture, but done without the insane kill everyone thing. Eventually we would out advance the modern world in which we take it over. Hopefully, with as little bloodshed as possible. I guess it's bad to fantasize world domination...

Now back to the actual conversation.

I really feel you Ashley, between people that like to ignore everything that doesn't involve them or the people willing to accept one's policies and totally disregard the other policies, annoys the hell out of me.

Well, i had more to say, but I completely lost it...

I just don't feel like a revolt is possible in the U.S., and I'm equally skeptical that working through the system can do anything. So yeah. Canada, eh?

You bring up a very valid point, Versus. I agree that I feel that the state in the US is literally too powerful and the system itself is almost to the point of not being fixable.

And then it gets even weirder. Take Greece for example.

I'll call it. WHY THE FUCK is the silent majority of Greece not hunting down and executing every single Golden Dawn member and sympathizer? They are going around murdering non-whites left and right and they occupy 7% of the seats in Greece's government. They said that after they were done with the immigrants, they were coming after the homosexuals next. And yet I'd not heard of a single thing about counter fighting and anti-fascist violence. Apparently, 50% of the police in Greece are sympathetic to the Golden Dawn. At least from this article I read.

Why?

I think it's because individuals don't care unless they're affected directly by what's going on around them. For instance, the bank bailouts a few years ago during the financial crisis and people were up in arms about it and rightfully so, when their tax dollars were going to keep the same loan sharks in business who caused the mess in the first place. But since then, except for the Occupy Movement, people have more or less forgotten about what caused it and idiotically fought tooth and nail against any measure that would keep it from happening again.

I don't think you're aware of the scariest part of all of this though. The Nazi's started off with just 7% as well. If things continue at this rate, we're looking at the next Nazi Germany. If things continue at this rate....we're all dead. Please refer to the bottom quote in my signature.

Just remember, Alan 2024.

That actually made me chuckle.

Didn't someone burn down the Golden Dawn offices or something? And there have been protest marches against them but I don't know the numbers. But yeah, disturbing to know how much the police voted for them.

Anyway, the Cracker von Patriarchs of the world do understand the politics of divide and conquer. I was talking about this on facebook a bit earlier, about how lesbianism has been hijacked by patriarchy to the point where if you're a queer woman, odds are you're going to be accused of only being interested in women to appeal to men, (particularly if you're femme, I should have added, some of us try to avoid it by *looking* more queer and butch), you're just bi-curious, its not serious, you can't be a gold star lesbian now. And the LGBTQ movement internalizes that and we oppress each other in the end. And then you got white gay people who are all like "BLACK PEOPLE ARE SOOOOO HOMOPHOBIC AND THEY PASSED PROP 8 THEY OPPRESS US", you know, like black queers don't exist or are far more likely to suffer from violence at the hands of homophobes and transphobes.

You know I can go on and on about this, but what I'm trying to say is the left really needs to get its shit together, recognize the divide and conquer tactic, deconstruct privilege and truly become intersectional. I'm sick and tired of lefist groups who don't care about sexism or racism, sick and tired of racist and transphobic feminists, sick and tired of oppression from people who should know fucking better.

^^^I completely agree with this. It's really a shame that the Leftist groups don't realize this and work together on it.

u guys can come a chrash over here:) in New Zealand!!
sure theres a government, i think if there's a zombie apocolypse they report it to queen or something, but other than that we're all pretty laid back. we was the first to give womens rights and if your into politics(about 2% of our population) then u shld be pleased to know we're on the brink of legalising gay marriage. anyway it's sweet as here, im not sure what US is like it sounds mad to be honest, and i'd rather avoid the brits they're trouble, but apart from samoa and antarctica new zealands pretttyyy choice:) mind u them pengiuns seem quite friendly^-^
gotta be 18 to buy boose(or you know, just get a mate to buy it) and 17 to get a licence.

This gives me hope for my grandson's future.
All of you probably know but just a reminder:
Even if the good fight doesn't make much progress now, remember that you are moving the tide over time for future humanity. Even baby steps are ok as long as they are in the best direction.

This thread is everything I love about G.net. I wish more of my IRL friends thought like you guys.

Which makes me think, really. Most of them are on the same page, but think I take certain things "too far/too seriously" (a recent example would be a Facebook argument in which people were making LOL-ful conversation about the hilarity of dwarf-tossing and how they should be dressed up like little gnomes and jesters, that had me fucking raging and staring crazily at the monitor with one eye by the end. What depressed me most was that every single one of the people involved would have come down on a comparably racist or homophobic comment like a tonne of bricks. Yet because they don't know any dwarves or disabled folk, it's totally cool to dehumanise them, just as long as it's COMPLETELY HILARIOUS).

I guess it feeds back to Ashley's rant (which was just beautiful, btw). It genuinely does not compute for many that the people outside of their narrow experience are REAL PEOPLE, with lives and thoughts and feelings as sensitive as their own. The whole "well you live in a first world country so why are you so pissed off?" basically suggests you're an idiot for not simply thinking "rather them than me" then forgetting all about it and going off to revel in your good fortune.

The whole 'legal = moral' mindset is a huge enabler here: for instance, my dad, who had enough money to take his pension and go full expat to avoid getting taxed UK rates on it, genuinely believes himself morally superior to those who avoid tax illegally. You cannot convince him that the only difference between him & them is more money, because what's he's done is legal, and in his mind, that's all there is to it. Somewhat like those people AshleyO is talking about, there's an unconscious assumption at play here - that 'if that's what the law says then it must be that way for a reason'. Few people would admit to believing this, yet it's an attitude that defenders of the status quo betray again and again, in my experience.

The thing that really gets me down isn't so much the system itself. Brutal and horrifying as it often is, I can understand that those at the top are benefitting from it; OF COURSE they don't want it to change. I get that. I might abhor it, but I get it. It isn't even the thoughtless complicity of many IN the system, that mixes blind self-interest with casual lack of empathy. Most of all, it's the fact that you can fucking EXPLAIN to otherwise intelligent, caring people about X issue and why their take on it is dehumanising and shitty towards others, and have them turn round and argue that you're taking shit too seriously for getting genuinely angry about something that doesn't affect you personally.

I guess I come across as dismissive when there is a discussion about the state of US politics as a whole, but the truth is there is so much that is so extremely fucked up that I become emotionally exhausted and just kind of shut down.

If we are talking about a specific issue then yeah I'll get angry or frustrated but it will (most likely) be a useful, meaningful, serious discussion, but with a big picture kind of look these days I just don't have it in me.

Get out of my head, Charles.

Oh man... I'm trippin' on acid.

I'm gonna beat yo ass, Charles. I'm gonna beat yo ass with Charles!