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edible_eye · 09-07-2005, 12:29 PM

for anyone who takes offense to what i've written here, and i'm sure some will - hell, maybe everyone will, please understand that i do feel sadness for everyone and anyone who is still waiting to hear from friends and loved ones. that doesn't cange.
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michael moore is a fool. every time he opens his mouth, he proves it yet again.

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and, peter - you're wrong about state vs. federal government. eps hit the nail on the head.

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i wanted to stay out of this because i have no vested interest in any of the affected areas - other than the fact that the refugees or evacuees or whatever they're asking to be called for the sake of political correctness, in their time of need, are - and will continue to filter their way elsewhere across the country. some of them are legal citizens, many of them are not. the financial burden for this will extend to many of us who were not directly affected for possibly years to come, the same as it would if they remained in new orleans, obviously - but now it will be in our own backyard and as such, our state tax revenues will be stretched just a bit more thin. the concept of charity in this country will be challenged in a whole, new way - whereas we are usually content to write a check and mail it off in a time of need, allowing "someone else" to handle the physical interventions, we are now facing the prospect of actually BEING our brother's keeper, of welcoming people into our towns and for those who feel the need to enter the spotlight, perhaps harbor extreme guilt or to a lesser degree have a true streak of altruism, into their homes thusly ensuring their housing, daily living expenses, medical care, transportation, etc. to the tune of 1.3 million people - a fair percentage of whom remain illegal aliens, like i said earlier. here in massachusetts, we've decided to accept 2500 of the displaced and in doing so, have streamlined or bypassed many criteria that children living in our state have to adhere to in order to attend school. in the grand scheme, that's all well and good for i'd rather have the children in school (if they have to be here) than prowling the streets, however i also have to wonder, in the fine print, whether or not all of the children coming to the area and entering our school system have actually had their vaccines - especially the illegal aliens - and whether or not my own children have the potential for exposure to something they wouldn't have otherwise.

that's not to say i don't realize or appreciate the significant tragedy of the situation - i'm not a thoroughly heartless bastard - it's just that the only way i feel i can get involved in this discussion is from a cold distance. i see and hear reports of people welcoming others into their homes right now, in the thick of it, while the cameras are on and the news reporters are lauding their generosity. what will happen to these same people when their host families realize that the ones they've accepted are messy, have no interest in working or have no skills to find a job, drink excessively or use drugs, are severely depressed, traumatized, might possibly pose a threat to the families or the area into which they are welcomed - or when the news reporters dry up and really, no one cares any longer that they've done their good deed? what then?

it's natural, in a good-human, intact-conscience way to want to help - especially when you or i cast a glance at the absolute devastation that has befallen the area. everything there is just gone. it's also natural, i believe, for the ones affected, to shed their tears and then set about rebuilding their life after such a catastrophe has befallen them. those who are easily moved, on a whim, from one place to another as long as a government check finds its way to their home don't fit that criteria - in my opinion.

i'm disgusted that a city which existed beneath sea level and was subjected to hurricanes annually had no tried and true shelter, relief and / or evacuation plan set in stone. how is that possible? the planning by the local and state government, town boards and individual citizenry was truly pathetic, wholly ignorant and for what it's worth - responsible for setting the stage of the whole botched drama which has followed. louisiana government failed its people.

every year, i've heard of concern regarding the potential for flooding, specifically concerning the levee system when a storm has ripped through there, only to be replaced by the "we made it through again" relief, as though the city were carving another notch in its belt. how they couldn't have a decent emergency plan in place throughout it all is mind-boggling. really. bussing people en masse away from their homeland now brings to mind a legion of people who have grown to rely so specifically on the government for their livlihood, they have not the mental capacity to decide on their own future. they yell, they scream, they get on a bus and they wait for their next check.

relying on the government to such a degree has paralyzed them. and in their paralysis, they are set up to fail in everything they do for the system that supports them is a failure in itself in its bizarre attempts to regulate every aspect of their lives.

the race issue is an old, tired and played out hand. it adds nothing to the discussion. it diverts attention from the real issue - citizens in this country have to start taking more responsibility for themselves. relying on the government to save you in a time of crisis doesn't work. by the time they get around to it - it might be too late.

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ok. that said, this is why i disagree with you, peter -

state and local government absolutely ARE responsible for their own, over and above the federal level. the epicenter is local, expanding out to state and finally to federal. the federal government can not arbitrarily enter a local or state jurisdiction and take command. the feds must be invited in and one way for that to happen is to declare a state of emergency. or better put, local and state government must declare that they've lost control.

the mayor of new orleans was incompetent - i'd even go so far as to say he's responsible for the rapes and deaths of those in the superdome. the governor of louisiana was incompetent. their ability to effectively deal with a crisis led to people's death. and all they can do now is point fingers elsewhere.

the federal government, now that they are involved, have shown a rather poor response to cleaning up the mess - but they should have been involved right from the start. there should not have been a delay. but the government is the government. they're not a bunch of gods who can snap their fingers and instantly reverse the horror that was set in motion. when a full truck is starting to slip over the side of a cliff, there's no guarantee it can be pulled back onto flat ground just because you finally get around to calling in the strongest equipment. and if you wait too long to call in that equipment, you can't then blame it for not rectifying the problem to begin with. the mayor and the governor were entrusted to care for the people of louisiana. they failed.

the weather will do what the weather always does. what new orleans has suffered and what we've all bore witness to and still bear witness to is the failing of man. the government is a massive, lumbering beast, not an omnipotent entity and for anyone who ascribes to the latter philosophy, they are doomed to be disappointed again and again.

09-07-2005, 12:29 PM	#36
edible_eye Join Date: Jul 2004 Posts: 3,793	for anyone who takes offense to what i've written here, and i'm sure some will - hell, maybe everyone will, please understand that i do feel sadness for everyone and anyone who is still waiting to hear from friends and loved ones. that doesn't cange. ------------------------------------------------ michael moore is a fool. every time he opens his mouth, he proves it yet again. --------------------------------------------- and, peter - you're wrong about state vs. federal government. eps hit the nail on the head. --------------------------------------------- i wanted to stay out of this because i have no vested interest in any of the affected areas - other than the fact that the refugees or evacuees or whatever they're asking to be called for the sake of political correctness, in their time of need, are - and will continue to filter their way elsewhere across the country. some of them are legal citizens, many of them are not. the financial burden for this will extend to many of us who were not directly affected for possibly years to come, the same as it would if they remained in new orleans, obviously - but now it will be in our own backyard and as such, our state tax revenues will be stretched just a bit more thin. the concept of charity in this country will be challenged in a whole, new way - whereas we are usually content to write a check and mail it off in a time of need, allowing "someone else" to handle the physical interventions, we are now facing the prospect of actually BEING our brother's keeper, of welcoming people into our towns and for those who feel the need to enter the spotlight, perhaps harbor extreme guilt or to a lesser degree have a true streak of altruism, into their homes thusly ensuring their housing, daily living expenses, medical care, transportation, etc. to the tune of 1.3 million people - a fair percentage of whom remain illegal aliens, like i said earlier. here in massachusetts, we've decided to accept 2500 of the displaced and in doing so, have streamlined or bypassed many criteria that children living in our state have to adhere to in order to attend school. in the grand scheme, that's all well and good for i'd rather have the children in school (if they have to be here) than prowling the streets, however i also have to wonder, in the fine print, whether or not all of the children coming to the area and entering our school system have actually had their vaccines - especially the illegal aliens - and whether or not my own children have the potential for exposure to something they wouldn't have otherwise. that's not to say i don't realize or appreciate the significant tragedy of the situation - i'm not a thoroughly heartless bastard - it's just that the only way i feel i can get involved in this discussion is from a cold distance. i see and hear reports of people welcoming others into their homes right now, in the thick of it, while the cameras are on and the news reporters are lauding their generosity. what will happen to these same people when their host families realize that the ones they've accepted are messy, have no interest in working or have no skills to find a job, drink excessively or use drugs, are severely depressed, traumatized, might possibly pose a threat to the families or the area into which they are welcomed - or when the news reporters dry up and really, no one cares any longer that they've done their good deed? what then? it's natural, in a good-human, intact-conscience way to want to help - especially when you or i cast a glance at the absolute devastation that has befallen the area. everything there is just gone. it's also natural, i believe, for the ones affected, to shed their tears and then set about rebuilding their life after such a catastrophe has befallen them. those who are easily moved, on a whim, from one place to another as long as a government check finds its way to their home don't fit that criteria - in my opinion. i'm disgusted that a city which existed beneath sea level and was subjected to hurricanes annually had no tried and true shelter, relief and / or evacuation plan set in stone. how is that possible? the planning by the local and state government, town boards and individual citizenry was truly pathetic, wholly ignorant and for what it's worth - responsible for setting the stage of the whole botched drama which has followed. louisiana government failed its people. every year, i've heard of concern regarding the potential for flooding, specifically concerning the levee system when a storm has ripped through there, only to be replaced by the "we made it through again" relief, as though the city were carving another notch in its belt. how they couldn't have a decent emergency plan in place throughout it all is mind-boggling. really. bussing people en masse away from their homeland now brings to mind a legion of people who have grown to rely so specifically on the government for their livlihood, they have not the mental capacity to decide on their own future. they yell, they scream, they get on a bus and they wait for their next check. relying on the government to such a degree has paralyzed them. and in their paralysis, they are set up to fail in everything they do for the system that supports them is a failure in itself in its bizarre attempts to regulate every aspect of their lives. the race issue is an old, tired and played out hand. it adds nothing to the discussion. it diverts attention from the real issue - citizens in this country have to start taking more responsibility for themselves. relying on the government to save you in a time of crisis doesn't work. by the time they get around to it - it might be too late. ----------------------------------------------- ok. that said, this is why i disagree with you, peter - state and local government absolutely ARE responsible for their own, over and above the federal level. the epicenter is local, expanding out to state and finally to federal. the federal government can not arbitrarily enter a local or state jurisdiction and take command. the feds must be invited in and one way for that to happen is to declare a state of emergency. or better put, local and state government must declare that they've lost control. the mayor of new orleans was incompetent - i'd even go so far as to say he's responsible for the rapes and deaths of those in the superdome. the governor of louisiana was incompetent. their ability to effectively deal with a crisis led to people's death. and all they can do now is point fingers elsewhere. the federal government, now that they are involved, have shown a rather poor response to cleaning up the mess - but they should have been involved right from the start. there should not have been a delay. but the government is the government. they're not a bunch of gods who can snap their fingers and instantly reverse the horror that was set in motion. when a full truck is starting to slip over the side of a cliff, there's no guarantee it can be pulled back onto flat ground just because you finally get around to calling in the strongest equipment. and if you wait too long to call in that equipment, you can't then blame it for not rectifying the problem to begin with. the mayor and the governor were entrusted to care for the people of louisiana. they failed. the weather will do what the weather always does. what new orleans has suffered and what we've all bore witness to and still bear witness to is the failing of man. the government is a massive, lumbering beast, not an omnipotent entity and for anyone who ascribes to the latter philosophy, they are doomed to be disappointed again and again.