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Old 03-03-2013, 04:30 PM   #1
Lady_Ligeia
 
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Why do people who linger where they are not wanted

Psychology is a spectacular fascination of mine and I am usually excellent at understanding people, which is why I'm attending graduate school for social work. However, I do not understand people who hang out at places where their presence is not wanted. I'm talking about non-autistic people who don't appear to have any issues with dwelling in places where the majority of the people want them gone. Honestly, I get uncomfortable if I'm in a room with just one person doesn't like me (because it doesn't happen often) so I really have no idea how these kinds of people feel alright with themselves while doing it.

I live in an on-campus apartment and on multiple occasions, my roommates and I have had people continue to chill when the people there clearly do not want them there and let them know it, always through nonverbal communication but sometimes, the obvious must be reiterated with verbal communication. I've known people that have attempted to return to our place THREE TIMES after one of us asked/forced them to leave. I totally understand that people can misinterpret or fail to catch on to social cues, but when people are blatantly insulting you and asking you to leave, WHY THE HELL WOULD YOU WANT TO BE THERE? It's flinch-inducing to watch people be mean to each other and social rejection is harsh but how do these people feel alright about it. I've chalked it down to a lack of boundaries, respect for the boundaries of others and (sometimes) overall social awareness, but there's got to be more to it. Any answers?

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Old 03-04-2013, 02:23 AM   #2
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Ableism is ugly.
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Old 03-04-2013, 06:39 PM   #3
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Ableism is ugly.
I am legitimately curious and do not intend to instigate or insult you, but how was I being ableist? It's an entirely different story if someone has a disability that prevents them from properly assessing and reacting to social situations.

Also, I'm sorry about the stupid title of this thread - I was deciding between two titles and guess I wasn't careful enough when crafting one.
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Old 03-05-2013, 12:40 AM   #4
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It is entirely different if someone has a disability that prevents them from assessing and reacting to a social situation, but the idea that only someone with autism (or more properly - someone who scores high on the autism spectrum) would be understandably would have a reason to not react in the expected way is ableist.. and it perpetuates the idea that people who score highly on the autism spectrum will have problems assessing and reacting to social situations, which isn't necessarily the case.

Ultimately, there was no real need to pick out that group of people, and you did so because of a stereotype that you wanted to convey.

To answer the question in your first post - perhaps these people just WANT to be where they are, and don't particularly care if they are wanted in that place or not. How is it that you are the one who gets to decide whether their presence is acceptable? What if they are thinking the same thing of all of you, and have decided that you are the people who should move on?

Or, perhaps you could be adult about it and let them exist in the same space that you exist in?
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Old 03-05-2013, 02:36 AM   #5
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I think the question was about people lingering at her place, it would be kind of weird for someone to decide that she should should be the one to leave.

If a person has been asked to leave then they should respect that it is your space and go. If people are showing up uninvited when you have asked them not to, that's fucking rude. What is most likely happening is that you and your roommate are easy to push over and take advantage of so they are there for what they can get from you, not to actually spend time with you. It's a dick move on their part but there are a lot of dicks in the world.
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Old 03-05-2013, 09:12 AM   #6
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Lightbulb

I specified non-autistic persons because I (as someone who has known many people with Aspergers Syndrome) figured someone would chime in and say, "Well, what about people with Aspergers, you (insert insult of choice)!" And rightfully so, of course!

Here's what inspired this post:

There was a small party at my place. One of our neighbors came over and started talking with one of my apartment mates and our other friends that were there. After he shook hands with her, his immediate response to her introduction was, "So, you're a lesbian?" (For the record, she is a lesbian and found it very rude that this was the first thing he brought up by assessing her appearance.) I have never had any problems with this kid, but I can get along with anyone and it takes a lot to offend me. However, I'm also the most assertive of the bunch because I can do it without being aggressive. I wasn't there for a lot of the night, but all of the friends that were around him(including friends from home) said that they felt uncomfortable with his presence because he was being aggressive and awkward. Awkward is fine, but uncomfortable awkwardness is not - ESPECIALLY at this liberal school and in my circle of liberal friends, so yes, this was a problem.
Rather than lying, I (very nicely) explained to him that everyone in there did not like him and although I have never had any negative encounters with him, my apartment mate specifically wanted him to leave. After a while, they started being mean to him and this was before I was informed about the situation, so he had to have known he was not wanted here. He kept trying to convince me to let him stay. I repeated that I have no problem with him but that I thought that his actions towards my apartment mate and friends were very rude and unsettlingly awkward. While we were doing shots in our kitchen, he walked in and picked up one of the sodas that one of my visiting friends brought to provide a mix. Everyone remarked that it belonged to my friend, but he continued to open it and pour himself some. These actions display an unsettling disregard for the property and space of others. Because someone recently stole a large bag of rare herbs from one of my other apartment mates, this is a matter of heightened concern.

The kid came back... three times. I wasn't around the third time he came back, but he laughingly said, "If you want me to leave, just say so!" In response, she firmly repeated (once again) that she wanted him to leave.

Trust me... Sometimes, I can't tell when I'm being treated badly but I am not a push-over. It's just that the people I'm referring to do not regard the boundaries of others, but the question still stands... WHY would someone ever want to linger in a place where the owner of the property and guests don't want them there after they've been told to leave? He didn't seem to have too much remorse for his actions, either, nor the social intelligence to see what he did wrong even after I elucidated everything for him in a candid but respectful and sensitive way. I told him I would be totally willing to discuss it the next day, but at that point, he was just mad (at me) and refusing to see the situation (as well as my part in it) for what it is. Most people would rather just lie to someone to get them away, but I'd rather tell them the truth. I find it to be easier (most of the time) but I know SO many people that cannot handle any confrontation to the slightest degree. It takes a lot to push these people to make them dislike someone.

Oy vey!
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Old 03-05-2013, 09:19 AM   #7
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Originally Posted by Miss Absynthe View Post

To answer the question in your first post - perhaps these people just WANT to be where they are, and don't particularly care if they are wanted in that place or not. How is it that you are the one who gets to decide whether their presence is acceptable? What if they are thinking the same thing of all of you, and have decided that you are the people who should move on?

Or, perhaps you could be adult about it and let them exist in the same space that you exist in?
If it's my property or the person who presides over the space, then yes, I/they do reserve the right to get rid of unwanted presences. I typically prefer to peacefully coexist with everyone, but I assure you, if someone manages to push me to the point where I can't deal with their presence, they are an extremely obnoxious, abrasive and/or unpleasant in a VERY disturbing way. It is very hard to creep me out or offend me so if I find a behavior to be messed up, I usually find that my friends consider it tenfold that amount. However, this is the internet so I can't expect you to take my word for it rather than assume that I'm simply intolerant.
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Old 03-05-2013, 01:07 PM   #8
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Miss Absynthe View Post
It is entirely different if someone has a disability that prevents them from assessing and reacting to a social situation, but the idea that only someone with autism (or more properly - someone who scores high on the autism spectrum) would be understandably would have a reason to not react in the expected way is ableist.. and it perpetuates the idea that people who score highly on the autism spectrum will have problems assessing and reacting to social situations, which isn't necessarily the case.

Ultimately, there was no real need to pick out that group of people, and you did so because of a stereotype that you wanted to convey.
Oh whatever, it was perfectly clear that Lady_Ligeia wasn't picking out any particular group of people, she was wondering why individuals, who do not suffer from a disorder of neural development characterized by impaired social interaction and communication, exhibit impaired social interaction and communication.

The reason is, that the guy was a dick.
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Old 03-05-2013, 01:32 PM   #9
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Lady_Ligeia View Post
I specified non-autistic persons because I (as someone who has known many people with Aspergers Syndrome) figured someone would chime in and say, "Well, what about people with Aspergers, you (insert insult of choice)!" And rightfully so, of course!

Here's what inspired this post:

There was a small party at my place. One of our neighbors came over and started talking with one of my apartment mates and our other friends that were there. After he shook hands with her, his immediate response to her introduction was, "So, you're a lesbian?" (For the record, she is a lesbian and found it very rude that this was the first thing he brought up by assessing her appearance.) I have never had any problems with this kid, but I can get along with anyone and it takes a lot to offend me. However, I'm also the most assertive of the bunch because I can do it without being aggressive. I wasn't there for a lot of the night, but all of the friends that were around him(including friends from home) said that they felt uncomfortable with his presence because he was being aggressive and awkward. Awkward is fine, but uncomfortable awkwardness is not - ESPECIALLY at this liberal school and in my circle of liberal friends, so yes, this was a problem.
Rather than lying, I (very nicely) explained to him that everyone in there did not like him and although I have never had any negative encounters with him, my apartment mate specifically wanted him to leave. After a while, they started being mean to him and this was before I was informed about the situation, so he had to have known he was not wanted here. He kept trying to convince me to let him stay. I repeated that I have no problem with him but that I thought that his actions towards my apartment mate and friends were very rude and unsettlingly awkward. While we were doing shots in our kitchen, he walked in and picked up one of the sodas that one of my visiting friends brought to provide a mix. Everyone remarked that it belonged to my friend, but he continued to open it and pour himself some. These actions display an unsettling disregard for the property and space of others. Because someone recently stole a large bag of rare herbs from one of my other apartment mates, this is a matter of heightened concern.

The kid came back... three times. I wasn't around the third time he came back, but he laughingly said, "If you want me to leave, just say so!" In response, she firmly repeated (once again) that she wanted him to leave.

Trust me... Sometimes, I can't tell when I'm being treated badly but I am not a push-over. It's just that the people I'm referring to do not regard the boundaries of others, but the question still stands... WHY would someone ever want to linger in a place where the owner of the property and guests don't want them there after they've been told to leave? He didn't seem to have too much remorse for his actions, either, nor the social intelligence to see what he did wrong even after I elucidated everything for him in a candid but respectful and sensitive way. I told him I would be totally willing to discuss it the next day, but at that point, he was just mad (at me) and refusing to see the situation (as well as my part in it) for what it is. Most people would rather just lie to someone to get them away, but I'd rather tell them the truth. I find it to be easier (most of the time) but I know SO many people that cannot handle any confrontation to the slightest degree. It takes a lot to push these people to make them dislike someone.

Oy vey!
Ooooooh I know the type. The lesbian comments would be a major tip off. People who feel so entitled to say and do what they want and can't believe anyone would have a problem with their fuckery.
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