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| Politics "Under democracy, one party always devotes its chief energies to trying to prove that the other party is unfit to rule -and both commonly succeed, and are right."
-H.L. Menken |
11-23-2008, 02:09 PM
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#51
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Join Date: Jul 2008
Location: Raxacoricofallapatorius
Posts: 1,750
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Quote:
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Originally Posted by jack_the_knife
As long as the child is still in the womb, I think it's a parasite.
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Trust me, it's as much of a parasite after it's born.
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Because before too long there'll be nothing left alive, not a creature on the land or sea, a bird in the sky. They'll be shot, harpooned, eaten, and hunted too much, vivisected by the clever men who prove that there's no such things as a fair world with live and let live. The Royal family go hunting, what an example to give to the people they lead and that don't include me, I've seen enough pain and torture of those who can't speak...
- Tough Shit, Mickey by Conflict
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11-23-2008, 02:12 PM
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#52
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Join Date: May 2007
Posts: 1,419
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Quote:
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Originally Posted by AshtrayKitten
Homicide refers to the act of killing another human being. Opinion has nothing to do with it.
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Yes it does, because you're stating that the thing being killed is a human being.
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11-23-2008, 02:17 PM
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#53
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Join Date: Nov 2008
Posts: 146
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Originally Posted by Raptor
Yes it does, because you're stating that the thing being killed is a human being.
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You asked if I wanted it called something else, I responded that it should be properly identified and called for what it is or might be.
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11-23-2008, 02:37 PM
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#54
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Join Date: May 2007
Posts: 1,419
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And I said that people are able to form their own opinion. I don't see your point. Generally pro choice people use softer language, pro life people use harsher language.
Does it make a difference having abortion renamed to "legal homicide" or whatever you want to call it?
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11-23-2008, 02:43 PM
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#55
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Join Date: Jul 2008
Location: Raxacoricofallapatorius
Posts: 1,750
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Here, I'll settle this argument real quick.
When it's got it's own body and not clamped to someone like a parasitic leach, it gets rights, until then, people should have the right to treat it like a tapeworm.
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Because before too long there'll be nothing left alive, not a creature on the land or sea, a bird in the sky. They'll be shot, harpooned, eaten, and hunted too much, vivisected by the clever men who prove that there's no such things as a fair world with live and let live. The Royal family go hunting, what an example to give to the people they lead and that don't include me, I've seen enough pain and torture of those who can't speak...
- Tough Shit, Mickey by Conflict
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11-23-2008, 02:49 PM
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#56
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Join Date: May 2007
Posts: 1,419
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He isn't arguing the law as far as I can tell, just the words people use for it...
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11-23-2008, 02:54 PM
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#57
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Join Date: Jul 2008
Location: Raxacoricofallapatorius
Posts: 1,750
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His language resembles an idiotic pro-lifer.
Speaking of which, I'd like to take this time to vent.
Pro-lifers, GO FUCK YOURSELVES YOU SELF RIGHTEOUS HYPOCRITES!
You will protect a pile of under developed cells that act no more than a enormous tapeworm and yet you eat meat from a cow that has been viciously slaughtered and endlessly tortured. Go fuck yourselves. Until you're all staunch fucking vegans, you can never call yourself pro life, so go fuck off.
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Because before too long there'll be nothing left alive, not a creature on the land or sea, a bird in the sky. They'll be shot, harpooned, eaten, and hunted too much, vivisected by the clever men who prove that there's no such things as a fair world with live and let live. The Royal family go hunting, what an example to give to the people they lead and that don't include me, I've seen enough pain and torture of those who can't speak...
- Tough Shit, Mickey by Conflict
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11-23-2008, 02:56 PM
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#58
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Join Date: Jan 2006
Location: Earth.
Posts: 8,001
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Quote:
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Originally Posted by Joker_in_the_Pack
His language resembles an idiotic pro-lifer.
Speaking of which, I'd like to take this time to vent.
Pro-lifers, GO FUCK YOURSELVES YOU SELF RIGHTEOUS HYPOCRITES!
You will protect a pile of under developed cells that act no more than a enormous tapeworm and yet you eat meat from a cow that has been viciously slaughtered and endlessly tortured. Go fuck yourselves. Until you're all staunch fucking vegans, you can never call yourself pro life, so go fuck off.
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That's not true, and even a vegan diet leads to the death of animals, so shut up.
Pro-life does NOT mean all life and you know it. Pro-life is a phrase that refers SOLELY to human life.
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11-23-2008, 02:57 PM
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#59
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Join Date: Nov 2008
Posts: 146
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Quote:
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Originally Posted by Raptor
And I said that people are able to form their own opinion. I don't see your point. Generally pro choice people use softer language, pro life people use harsher language.
Does it make a difference having abortion renamed to "legal homicide" or whatever you want to call it?
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You're selectively choosing to argue over what it should be called, then what it is. I never asserted that it be renamed homicide, but that it be recognized as homicide, as an execution is.
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11-23-2008, 03:12 PM
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#60
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Join Date: May 2007
Posts: 1,419
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I'm trying to figure out what you're saying.
Recognised by who? If you don't mean legally then you mean people should think of it as homicide rather than anything else? It isn't your choice what other people recognise it as.
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11-23-2008, 03:19 PM
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#61
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Join Date: Jul 2008
Location: Raxacoricofallapatorius
Posts: 1,750
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Quote:
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Originally Posted by Underwater Ophelia
Pro-life does NOT mean all life and you know it. Pro-life is a phrase that refers SOLELY to human life.
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That is the hypocrisy. "Human" life is valued and all other is viewed as expendable. Pro-life is bullshit term.
__________________
Because before too long there'll be nothing left alive, not a creature on the land or sea, a bird in the sky. They'll be shot, harpooned, eaten, and hunted too much, vivisected by the clever men who prove that there's no such things as a fair world with live and let live. The Royal family go hunting, what an example to give to the people they lead and that don't include me, I've seen enough pain and torture of those who can't speak...
- Tough Shit, Mickey by Conflict
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11-23-2008, 03:20 PM
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#62
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Join Date: Dec 2004
Location: Cali
Posts: 8,030
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Quote:
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Originally Posted by Underwater Ophelia
Pro-life does NOT mean all life and you know it. Pro-life is a phrase that refers SOLELY to human life.
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It doesn't really seem to, from what I have seen it only refers to preventing abortions. I have seen many pro-lifers who are also pro-war and pro-capital punishment, both of which are things that end human life.
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Live a life less ordinary
Live a life extraordinary with me
Live a life less sedentary
Live a life evolutionary with me
-Carbon Leaf
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11-23-2008, 03:28 PM
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#63
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Join Date: Nov 2008
Posts: 523
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What the fucking hell has being on life support got to do with abortion and your 'opinion' that it is murder?
1) its also known as termination.
2) It serves as a way to stop more and more unwanted children being brought into the world and dumped.
3) If you are refering to the life support systems being turned off and you're trying to convince me that THAT is murder too, are they not usually turned off when a person is declared brain dead? at which point THEY ARE ALREADY FUCKING DEAD.
And seeing as abortion/termination of pregnancy is legal in a fair few countries now, if it bothers you that much, take it up with your government. I'm sure they will love to hear your views.
Do you actually have a point on this 'Abortion is Murder' bullshit or do you just want ppl to argue over something other than who made a racist/homophobic comment?
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11-23-2008, 03:38 PM
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#64
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Join Date: Jan 2006
Location: Earth.
Posts: 8,001
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Quote:
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Originally Posted by Joker_in_the_Pack
That is the hypocrisy. "Human" life is valued and all other is viewed as expendable. Pro-life is bullshit term.
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It's not hypocritical to care more about human life.
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11-23-2008, 03:44 PM
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#65
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Join Date: Jul 2008
Location: Raxacoricofallapatorius
Posts: 1,750
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Quote:
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Originally Posted by Underwater Ophelia
It's not hypocritical to care more about human life.
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It's hypocritical to say you want to preserve innocent lives and then eat the tortured flesh of an extinguished life.
__________________
Because before too long there'll be nothing left alive, not a creature on the land or sea, a bird in the sky. They'll be shot, harpooned, eaten, and hunted too much, vivisected by the clever men who prove that there's no such things as a fair world with live and let live. The Royal family go hunting, what an example to give to the people they lead and that don't include me, I've seen enough pain and torture of those who can't speak...
- Tough Shit, Mickey by Conflict
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11-23-2008, 03:52 PM
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#66
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Join Date: Jan 2006
Location: Earth.
Posts: 8,001
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Quote:
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Originally Posted by Joker_in_the_Pack
It's hypocritical to say you want to preserve innocent lives and then eat the tortured flesh of an extinguished life.
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THAT would be hypocritical, yes.
However, most pro-lifers are concerned mostly or solely with HUMAN innocent life, so it's not hypocritical.
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11-23-2008, 03:55 PM
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#67
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Join Date: Jan 2008
Location: London.
Posts: 324
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Quote:
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Originally Posted by Alarica
Do you actually have a point on this 'Abortion is Murder' bullshit or do you just want ppl to argue over something other than who made a racist/homophobic comment?
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It's called a discussion. Discussions usually take place on forums. If you don't like them, then piss off.
You seem like rather an insecure person.
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11-23-2008, 03:56 PM
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#68
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Join Date: May 2008
Location: Your mother.
Posts: 1,044
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Tortured?????
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11-23-2008, 04:00 PM
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#69
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Join Date: Jan 2006
Location: Earth.
Posts: 8,001
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Quote:
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Originally Posted by Necrophagist
Tortured?????
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Yeah.
Most animals are treated TERRIBLY in slaughterhouses.
It's pretty disgusting.
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11-23-2008, 04:18 PM
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#70
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Join Date: Nov 2008
Posts: 523
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Quote:
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Originally Posted by Bat Attack
It's called a discussion. Discussions usually take place on forums. If you don't like them, then piss off.
You seem like rather an insecure person.
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And you seem like the result of married cousins, and if you dont like my posts, ignore me.
My question wasnt aimed at you, so unless you posted the original thread, put your ego away. If you did post the original post in the thread then by all means answer me with a near intelligent response
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11-23-2008, 05:14 PM
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#71
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Join Date: Nov 2008
Posts: 146
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Quote:
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Originally Posted by Raptor
I'm trying to figure out what you're saying.
Recognised by who? If you don't mean legally then you mean people should think of it as homicide rather than anything else? It isn't your choice what other people recognise it as.
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This makes sense. Even if the sky is blue, some people might recognize it as being pink.
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Originally Posted by Alarica
What the fucking hell has being on life support got to do with abortion and your 'opinion' that it is murder?
1) its also known as termination.
2) It serves as a way to stop more and more unwanted children being brought into the world and dumped.
3) If you are refering to the life support systems being turned off and you're trying to convince me that THAT is murder too, are they not usually turned off when a person is declared brain dead? at which point THEY ARE ALREADY FUCKING DEAD.
And seeing as abortion/termination of pregnancy is legal in a fair few countries now, if it bothers you that much, take it up with your government. I'm sure they will love to hear your views.
Do you actually have a point on this 'Abortion is Murder' bullshit or do you just want ppl to argue over something other than who made a racist/homophobic comment?
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You sound so angry. You should calm down.
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11-23-2008, 05:24 PM
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#72
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Join Date: Nov 2008
Posts: 146
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Quote:
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Originally Posted by Alarica
What the fucking hell has being on life support got to do with abortion and your 'opinion' that it is murder?
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It has to do with your statement here:
Before this it isnt viable and is only 'alive' because the mothers body is keeping it alive.
Life support patients are not "only alive" because their life functions are being mechanically assisted, just as a fetus is not "only alive" because it's dependent on its mother.
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2) It serves as a way to stop more and more unwanted children being brought into the world and dumped.
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And slavery is good because it boosts the economy.
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And seeing as abortion/termination of pregnancy is legal in a fair few countries now, if it bothers you that much, take it up with your government. I'm sure they will love to hear your views.
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Maybe if you bothered to read the thread in its entirety before spouting off, you'd know that it doesn't bother me.
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Do you actually have a point on this 'Abortion is Murder' bullshit or do you just want ppl to argue over something other than who made a racist/homophobic comment?
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It's in the thread.
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11-23-2008, 05:42 PM
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#73
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Join Date: Feb 2008
Location: northeast us
Posts: 887
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Would discarded embryos produced by in vitro fertilization also be considered murder victims?
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11-23-2008, 05:50 PM
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#74
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Join Date: Nov 2008
Posts: 523
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Quote:
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Originally Posted by AshtrayKitten
Life support patients are not "only alive" because their life functions are being mechanically assisted, just as a fetus is not "only alive" because it's dependent on its mother.
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You are talking out of your arse. Atleast do a little bit of research on the subject you are attempting, lamely, to discuss.
There is a professor in foetal medicine at the Queen Charlottes and Chelsea hospital who had to perform a selective termination on a twin pregnancy. His name is Professor Fisk. 1 twin had developed without a head yet the body continued to grow just like its twin. the headless twin had to be selectively terminated because it was draining the mother and therefore nothing more than a parasite!! There was a long documentary on it, broadcast in the uk.
No head - was kept alive by the mother. Thats how pregnancy works.
Brain dead - kept alive artificially - STILL DEAD.
Turning a life support system off when the person has a chance of recovery i can see how that can be viewed as murder. Turning it off when brain death has occurred is not murder. You cant kill something that is already dead.
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11-23-2008, 05:55 PM
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#75
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Join Date: Jan 2006
Location: Earth.
Posts: 8,001
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Quote:
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Originally Posted by Alarica
You are talking out of your arse. Atleast do a little bit of research on the subject you are attempting, lamely, to discuss.
There is a professor in foetal medicine at the Queen Charlottes and Chelsea hospital who had to perform a selective termination on a twin pregnancy. His name is Professor Fisk. 1 twin had developed without a head yet the body continued to grow just like its twin. the headless twin had to be selectively terminated because it was draining the mother and therefore nothing more than a parasite!! There was a long documentary on it, broadcast in the uk.
No head - was kept alive by the mother. Thats how pregnancy works.
Brain dead - kept alive artificially - STILL DEAD.
Turning a life support system off when the person has a chance of recovery i can see how that can be viewed as murder. Turning it off when brain death has occurred is not murder. You cant kill something that is already dead.
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How, then, do you feel about killing something before brain life has begun?
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