Thoughts on feminism?

[Porphyria]

I was wondering if anyone has thought much about the double-edged sword that is the modern feminist movement.

How, if at all, has the movement helped the average woman and is that benefit worth the political, cultural and economic fallout it caused?

I'm going to answer my own question because I will inevitably be unable to keep my opinions to myself. I think the feminist movement, like all well-intended but hopelessly flawed things, has been more harmful than helpful to the average woman. Moreover, it has created a declining cultural and economic environment-- at least in America.

Let me explain. I think all people, regardless of sex, race, religion and so on, should be treated equally. With that said, I don't think modern feminists are fighting for equality; I think they're fighting for superiority. They want to be treated like men in regards to work, salary, rights, etc., which is completely fair. But they also want to continue to be the special, delicate flower for whom everyone should be willing to make exceptions and go out of their way to be a little more courteous. They don't seem to understand that, to be completely equal, a woman must be able to deal with the same social stresses as a man. She can't get offended at every water cooler joke about anal sex and cry harrassment if someone teases her about her weight. Men constantly fuck with one another. It's how they establish a social pecking order. If women can't embrace that behavior to some degree, they'll always be outsiders. In other words, you can't have your cake and eat it, too, ladies.

Another unintended side effect of the feminist movement has to do with the economic situation that came about when more women entered the work force. Up until the late 1970's most women still stayed at home. When more and more of them started to enter the workforce, it brought effectively twice as much money into the average family's pockets. When there is more money per household, the average cost of goods and services will increase. Greed is a huge factor in economics. So the cost of living increased exponentially in response to the increased per-household income which lead to the rampant inflation of the 1980's. Now it's nearly impossible to maintain a family on one income, much to the chagrin of single parents everywhere.

The last thing I want to drone about has to do with "Generation X" and subsequent generations who grew up/are growing up without a constant adult influence. Both of my parents worked full-time when I was growing up. I was raised primarily by daycare employees, teachers, neighbors, my grandparents and the other "orphans." It was like Lord of the Flies on my street in the summer. I'm not going to say much about this except that most of the trouble I got into as a kid (and it was quite a bit) could have been avoided if one of my parents had been around. I've sacrificed a lot and still consider myself fortunate to be able to stay home with my son. I'll be goddamned if I let him grow up the same way I did.

What do we do? I don't know. Perhaps if there wasn't such a stigma against men being primary caregivers for children (shows how very little gender stereotypes have changed over the past 50 years), moms would have started working and dads would have stayed home. Maybe we should abandon the traditional concept of "family" alltogether.

All I know is that truthfully, in people's hearts and minds, not much has changed. We still operate very frequently on common gender-based stereotypes. I had to argue with a man at the mechanic shop last Thursday because he was convinced my cruise control was not broken (it was) and that I just didn't know how to turn it on. If stuff like this still happens everywhere in the world on a daily basis, how much has all this feminism really changed society?

[Onetwothree]

I should act like you, and make a strawman argument against what you had to say, or pick out a particular inaccuracy and inflate it, but I am not a dick.

Modern feminists are good; you are talking about femnazis. I am a feminist.

[Porphyria]

Originally Posted by Onetwothree

I should act like you, and make a strawman argument against what you had to say, or pick out a particular inaccuracy and inflate it, but I am not a dick.

Modern feminists are good; you are talking about femnazis. I am a feminist.

You're very much a dick, dear, but that's beside the point.

I never argued with you on that other thread because it's a pointless debate. I just pointed out that you have no business trying to tell people what to think about things that have no concrete answer.

The above is my opinion. You can have whatever opinion you like and, unlike you, I won't have a tantrum and start calling people "emo" if it's not in line with mine. Disagree all you want, but at least try to explain your point of view. Otherwise, I'll assume you're simply being contentious because you don't like me.

I'm curious about other people's thoughts on the subject and not at all interested in starting a debate. If you ever manage to state an idea without being a tool, then maybe I'll take you seriously.

[Beneath the Shadows]

The double standard is definitely bullshit. If a couple tries to maintain a traditional family, if the woman stays home and cares for the children while the man works, the woman is "being repressed." If the man stays home while the woman works, the man is "lazy."

The double standard is everywhere. You can turn on a television and see a commercial in which a woman beats up a man. That's considered comedy, but if the man is beating the woman up, feminists will raise bloody hell! You can go to a court and watch a custody trial, and, even if the woman had a history of substance abuse and the man has a perfectly clean record, there's a good chance the woman will still get custody. When it comes to paying child support, if a man refuses to pay it, he's a dead-beat and everyone will be on his case, but if the woman refuses to pay, for some reason no one will say anything. If a woman is the victim of domestic violence, she's the victim, but when a man is the victim of domestic violence, the woman is still the victim. After all, according to most feminists, a woman wouldn't physically abuse a man unless she had been abused for a long time and suddenly snapped. Then there's health concerns. Watch television or look at billboards as you're driving, and you'll see plenty of ads for women's health concerns. You'll see maybe half as many for men's health concerns, and 90% are for erectile dysfunction.

And yet, despite all this blatant hypocrisy, most people still pander to them.

[Godslayer Jillian]

I will disagree with 123 until he can prove where did you make a straw man argument, but he's right in his last sentence.
The feminist movement was an important social movement, and it was to the betterment of society.
But as with most movements, when they get popularity, people feel attracted to it and try to show their 'support' when in fact they don't know shit about the ideals of said movement.
Real feminists do search for perfect equality. The problem is that most women that say they're feminists only say so because they're women; which is ironic because it's sexist that they're assigning themselves something that they consider they have to, or only want to for the sole reason that, precisely, they're women.
These women want to feel like feminists, but they're so impregnated with Victorian values that they can't, and the sole reason they want power is not for equality, but for power itself. These are the women you mentioned that would feel perfectly fine if they were considered superior to men. These are the kind of women that consider men below them, that they really think that just because they're women, they're prettier, smarter, and overall better.
These are sexists, not feminists.
Hell, I remember two years ago in an English class, we were reading The Yellow Wallpaper: a story about a woman that is losing her mind.
The woman had to be taking care of her loving husband and a nurse, and she loved her husband. But as her insanity grew worse, she began to loathe her husband, believing he locked her in that room with 'that hideous yellow wallpaper'[not the exact words] against her will.
After we reached this part of the story, the teacher told us to openly discuss it, and a girl said that it was unbelievable how 'insensitive' the man was and that (listen to this stupidity) she 'bets the husband is sleeping with the nurse'!!!
Stop watching soap operas, damn you!!
I told her that that's stupid; he's taking care of his wife, who is sick. She accused me of being sexist for defending the man; I accused her for being a feminist wannabe for making a weak attack to a secondary character based on nothing but the sole fact that he's a male.

[killer_asian_Dax]

Feminism has good intentions, but like most good intentions, they are sought in vain. I hate feminazis, despise feminists and feminist wannabes and until things change, am a proud demi-male chauvinist.

Like Porphyria (sorry if I messed up the spelling) mentioned, the dumb broads want their cake and to eat it too. Such is not the way of life and until they get that- they'll always be second banana to the men.

I have full respect for the women that understand the pecking order and what true equality to men means. Notice- those women also go much farther in life than the "feminists" who parade about with picket signs yelling "It's not fair."

[Underwater Ophelia]

This is what I think...if women wanna vote, get drafted. Bottom line.
I'm sick of women being stupid bitches.

And that BS about "women giving life" is just that--BS. When you and your lesbian lover can have a baby, then tell me women give life.

[Tha Duckman]

NOTHING grinds my FUCKING gears like Feminism. It's fucking RETARDED!!! [Flaming cock punches a Feminist in the ovaries]. Oh, you're a Feminist, you say? You want equal rights as men, you say? You just opened up a womens only gym, you say? Well, I'm just gonna mosey on over here, open my men only gym. What's this? Oh, it appears I have two dozen retard bitches out on my lawn picketing that I'm a fascist pig. UP YOURS, FUCKO!!! You're all DOUCHE BAGS, and I hope you die of DYSENTERY!!!

[Wise Child]

Nah... hepititis. Or AIDS. Or Sudden Death Syndrome. That'd be pretty cool.

Dysentery's a little too Third World. Mah country prides itself on clean ice.

[MollyMac]

It's only a double standard and double edged sword if you are weak and impressionable. If you have a spine, it's not an issue.

Ultimately, it is what you will make it, and what you will allow yourself to believe and be influenced by. You don't buy it because they sell it; they sell it because you buy.

That being said, with equal rights or privileges come equal responsibilities. Use your imagination.

[Onetwothree]

Originally Posted by Porphyria

You're very much a dick, dear, but that's beside the point.

I never argued with you on that other thread because it's a pointless debate. I just pointed out that you have no business trying to tell people what to think about things that have no concrete answer.

The above is my opinion. You can have whatever opinion you like and, unlike you, I won't have a tantrum and start calling people "emo" if it's not in line with mine. Disagree all you want, but at least try to explain your point of view. Otherwise, I'll assume you're simply being contentious because you don't like me.

I'm curious about other people's thoughts on the subject and not at all interested in starting a debate. If you ever manage to state an idea without being a tool, then maybe I'll take you seriously.

You don't even have the right to have an opinion yet, because you make stupid non-sequitur statements. They don't float in the real world, kid.

Still, you are talking about fem-nazis. Those are not feminists. I am evidence of that.

[Onetwothree]

Also, my thoughts on feminism are this:

Feminism is just one path to humanism. Women are looking for equality. Once they get that, they will become humanists. There will be a time when then inequality between men and women is gone.

[killer_asian_Dax]

But NOt anytime remotely soon


(My bet's on never)

[Onetwothree]

Originally Posted by killer_asian_Dax

But NOt anytime remotely soon


(My bet's on never)

Reason? Women are making 71 cents to the dollar that a man makes now. And it's only improving. I want to see them make just as much as me. Unless of course I am a fireman and they are too. They just don't have the physical stamina to be lumberjacks, or other insanely physical jobs.

When the playing field is equal, then they get equal pay, and vice versa for men as well. But if you are a woman trying to be a fire-fighter trying to carry a full grown man out, then you are only risking your life, and theirs.

Feminists need to accept that men are stronger than them, and there are slight differences. But there is no reason why they can't get paid the same, for the same level of work. As I said, firefighter women = no go. If you disagree, please give me a good reason.

[killer_asian_Dax]

Originally Posted by Onetwothree

Reason? Women are making 71 cents to the dollar that a man makes now. And it's only improving. I want to see them make just as much as me. Unless of course I am a fireman and they are too. They just don't have the physical stamina to be lumberjacks, or other insanely physical jobs.

When the playing field is equal, then they get equal pay, and vice versa for men as well. But if you are a woman trying to be a fire-fighter trying to carry a full grown man out, then you are only risking your life, and theirs.

Feminists need to accept that men are stronger than them, and there are slight differences. But there is no reason why they can't get paid the same, for the same level of work. As I said, firefighter women = no go. If you disagree, please give me a good reason.

I fully agree that women should NOT be firefighters, but take a look at what you posted in the middle paragraph: "Feminists need to accept that men are stronger than them, and there are slight differences."


There in lies the problem. MOST feminists DO NOT understand or accept that. Having a vagina myself, I unfortunately sometimes bear witness to such (and to my dismay, so many) dumb feminist sluts who will NEVER understand this. On and on they go about how EVERYTHING should be equal for men and women regardless of the way nature made us (men and women) different from each other. There will never be a level playing field so long as women that don't understand out number the ones that do. And last I checked it was a 244,356,646,257,125,356,356:5 ratio.

We've come a long way baby, but there's still miles and miles to go. Don't hold your breath.

[TopHaggardDoll]

Originally Posted by Onetwothree

Also, my thoughts on feminism are this:

Feminism is just one path to humanism. Women are looking for equality. Once they get that, they will become humanists. There will be a time when then inequality between men and women is gone.

Women create inequality for themselves, plus equality is as riduclous a notion as world peace, there are too many different opinions in the world for there to be that situation. Feminist or Femnazi bitch whores whatever you wanna call them, don't seem to want equality to me. They seem to want special treatment. I definately agree with Porphyria on that aspect. Plus, I think I need to add women create inequality for themselves by whoring themselves out then trying to pass it off as being a "strong woman", not to mention the fact women use their "assets" to get what they want from men.
They do all sorts of things like this, then get pissy if a guy looks at their legs because they're wearing a skirt the size of 4 teabags.

Women REALLY don't make sense sometimes.

As I said, firefighter women = no go. If you disagree, please give me a good reason.

What about female bodybuilders!?.....You're probably going to tell me i'm being ridiculous, but there is an example of women with enough strength to carry a person out of a burning building.

[killer_asian_Dax]

Originally Posted by TopHaggardDoll

Women create inequality for themselves, plus equality is as riduclous a notion as world peace, there are too many different opinions in the world for there to be that situation. Feminist or Femnazi bitch whores whatever you wanna call them, don't seem to want equality to me. They seem to want special treatment. I definately agree with Porphyria on that aspect. Plus, I think I need to add women create inequality for themselves by whoring themselves out then trying to pass it off as being a "strong woman", not to mention the fact women use their "assets" to get what they want from men.
They do all sorts of things like this, then get pissy if a guy looks at their legs because they're wearing a skirt the size of 4 teabags.

Women REALLY don't make sense sometimes.

As I said, firefighter women = no go. If you disagree, please give me a good reason.

What about female bodybuilders!?.....You're probably going to tell me i'm being ridiculous, but there is an example of women with enough strength to carry a person out of a burning building.

I'm quite certain she meant the average- NON bodybuilder types.

But the rest of your argument makes me love you and I don't even know who you are. <3

[TopHaggardDoll]

Originally Posted by killer_asian_Dax

I'm quite certain she meant the average- NON bodybuilder types.

Yeah...I was being facetious, also, female bodybuilders deserve a mention because they're cool.

[Tha Duckman]

I'm gonna find me a Feminist, **** her in the mouth, and blow my load up her nose. That'll learn 'em!

[Wise Child]

Why don't you just do her up the butt? She wants to be equal to a man, treat her like one. I mean, it's just the logical progression...

Oh god, my feminist theory teacher is gonna kill me for thinking un-feminist thoughts. Ah well... if you ask me she's gagging fr a good seeing-to herself.

[Tha Duckman]

The best way to fix an uppity chick chick is with a good, solid fuck up her butt. At least then she'll be able to speak properly.













In case you didn't get it, I meant all Feminists speak out their asses.

[Wise Child]

Told ya.

[MollyMac]

Women make 71% of a man's salary because they settle and don't know how to ask for or demand their worth. They expect it to be offered or given freely as a complement; when it is usually fought for and won as a reward.

[Beneath the Shadows]

I still think that women already have the upper hand, simply because they have boobs.

[Wise Child]

Yeah... if only they had the good sense to take over the world while the men are busy gawking, instead of just fluttering around and giggling.

If there's two things I can't stand, it's fluttering and giggling. Makes me loathe my sex.