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Old 10-21-2010, 10:18 AM   #4601
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It's not really a personal thing for me.
I'm also against "breast cancer awareness" bullshit. I've never been affected by breast cancer, nor has anyone close to me.
Yeah, and that's also stupid. Do you have any idea how powerful "awareness" really can be? No it doesn't cure cancer by itself, but guess what? It brings in money. It keeps people focused on an issue so that they can do bigger things, instead of simply going about their routine.

My guy Vagabond is walking around the world to "raise awareness" for the water Crisis in Zambia. His charity has already brought in over a million dollars to build wells and AIDS clinics. Hell, he got me to raise over $500 when I'd never given to charity before in my life.
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And still, you're confused about my problem with these people, but I've already repeated my point, and won't again.
Your problem is that you feel these people are using your struggles to feel better about themselves, and have no real impact on gay rights. I'm saying you're wrong, and also telling you to go fuck yourself.

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(Slightly unrelated--what were you referencing when you mentioned Jilly and JCC? I don't remember being against some kind of activist attempt they made.)
I'm not about to go digging through old posts, so lets just say this latest bout of apathetic misanthropy is part of a general trend for you. I just felt like calling you out on it today.
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Old 10-21-2010, 10:25 AM   #4602
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For smaller causes, yeah, I'm a fan of the whole money thing.

For things like AIDS and breast cancer, though, I'm not so sure. People have been pouring BILLIONS into this already. I'm not against a private donation.
I'm against making breast cancer cool, just like I'm against making gay problems cool.
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Old 10-21-2010, 10:28 AM   #4603
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For smaller causes, yeah, I'm a fan of the whole money thing.

For things like AIDS and breast cancer, though, I'm not so sure. People have been pouring BILLIONS into this already. I'm not against a private donation.
I'm against making breast cancer cool, just like I'm against making gay problems cool.
Funny, you sound just like Tam Li Hua when she said she was against making gay problems cool when prop 8 was overturned.

Tell me, if this was 50 years ago, would you be against making "black problems" cool?

Guess what: It's always annoying when a genuine cause becomes "trendy", but cool shit gets attention, and that's what this issue needs now.

So what if you have to deal with a few douchebag trendys who are just there to pose? I'd say it's a small price to pay for the strides that are happening in gay rights.
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Old 10-21-2010, 10:30 AM   #4604
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Funny, you sound just like Tam Li Hua when she said she was against making gay problems cool when prop 8 was overturned.

Tell me, if this was 50 years ago, would you be against making "black problems" cool?

Guess what: It's always annoying when a genuine cause becomes "trendy", but cool shit gets attention, and if you have to deal with a few douchebag trendys, I'd say it's a small price to pay for the strides that are happening in gay rights.
Yes, I would be against black problems being considered cool.
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Old 10-21-2010, 10:38 AM   #4605
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So once again you would've sat back and silently agreed with all those civil rights activists, but told them not to make trouble because "it wasn't going to change anything" "Don't go to that Million Man March; it's just hype and there are so many n*ggers who are just there to be seen"

Right?

You're doing the exact same thing Versus was in the abortion thread. You're railing against a ridiculous straw-man that isn't even real. This "secret gay hipster" you hate ISN'T REAL in any meaningful sense. I mean I'm sure there were maybe 5-20 assholes out there just for the party, but guess what? They inadvertently raised awareness for an important issue and showed solidarity with the gay community.

Why object to an entire movement just because you don't like a handfull of assholes who are superficially associated with it?
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Old 10-21-2010, 10:45 AM   #4606
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Again, you've completely twisted my words around.
This is annoying to me.
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Old 10-21-2010, 10:47 AM   #4607
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Why object to an entire movement just because you don't like a handfull of assholes who are superficially associated with it?
I'm not objecting to a movement. Wearing a purple shirt isn't a movement.
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Old 10-21-2010, 10:51 AM   #4608
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Again, you've completely twisted my words around.
This is annoying to me.
You know, Ophelia, this seems to be a very common trend where people "miss your point". Is it possible that you don't know how to adequately communicate your points?
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Old 10-21-2010, 10:54 AM   #4609
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Again, you've completely twisted my words around.
This is annoying to me.
Do you not speak English?

You said you hated the idea of someone fetishizing your struggles and making them into a fashion statement. I'm gonna agree with you, that's pretty trifeling.

But here you're throwing the baby out with the bathwater. You're letting a few assholes ruin the very positive, very necessary message that was being communicated yesterday. You're saying that yesterday, no one said anything and what they did was worthless and downright disgusting. That's wrong, stupid, and fucked-up yo.

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I'm not objecting to a movement. Wearing a purple shirt isn't a movement.
It's a small part of one. Shit like that is how movements sustain themselves. It's like the candle scene in Gangs of New York: It's a simple ritual that everyone can do to communicate their feelings on an issue. Just because it doesn't change everything overnight doesn't make it worthless or a self-indulgent pornographic act.
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Old 10-21-2010, 10:55 AM   #4610
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double post
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I promote radical change through my actions.
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Old 10-21-2010, 10:58 AM   #4611
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I'm not objecting to a movement. Wearing a purple shirt isn't a movement.
No one saying it was a movement. It's a SMALL activity for those that believe in equal rights across the board to represent. It was like hoisting a flag and saying "This is what I stand for."

It wasn't a movement of itself, it was just an activity within that movement. Was it ineffectual? Maybe. But those that did it consciously was saying in some small way that they are on your side.

Interestingly enough, while I was going to work yesterday, there was a shit load of barneys out there. A SHIT LOAD.
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Old 10-21-2010, 10:59 AM   #4612
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Look, I'm bored of this, so I'm going to rant about something else.

But first, yes, Kontan, I do have trouble making myself understood.
Second, I didn't say wearing the shirt was disgusting, I said the breast cancer pink ribbon thing was disgusting.
Lastly, through the magic of facebook, I know TONS of people who did/are participating. None are actualy helping, and all of them think it's AWESOME!!!!!!.



Now for something different. Glee. What the fuck is this? I had never seen it before a few seconds ago, assuming it was the lamest shit ever.

GOOD CHRIST WAS I RIGHT.
Rocky Horror is fun, and Glee took a good thing and and choked everything good out of it.
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Old 10-21-2010, 11:00 AM   #4613
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Not to mention that morale is a very powerful thing. Every year the rrape crisis center organizes a Take Back The Night March, and my university has the Vagina Monologues. It doesn't make a difference, no, but it creates awareness AND we all feel fantastic and renewed afterwards. I only got involved with Pride events this year so I have no idea what it was like before gay marriage was legal and rights were restricted, but it really made everyone feel good.

There's been a lot of LGBTQ suicides and bullying reports in the news lately, and its horribly depressing, on top of the homophobia regularly spewed by politicians. Its disheartening. Wearing purple doesn't change the law, but seeing so many people wearing it certainly shows support to those who might otherwise feel alone or alienated. It was like a quiet Pride event.
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Old 10-21-2010, 11:09 AM   #4614
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There's been a lot of LGBTQ suicides and bullying reports in the news lately, and its horribly depressing, on top of the homophobia regularly spewed by politicians. Its disheartening. Wearing purple doesn't change the law, but seeing so many people wearing it certainly shows support to those who might otherwise feel alone or alienated. It was like a quiet Pride event.
This basically.

And Ophelia, you're just THINKING that ALL of those guys on Facebook were doing nothing to help and that's just plain ol' incorrect.
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Old 10-21-2010, 11:19 AM   #4615
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This basically.

And Ophelia, you're just THINKING that ALL of those guys on Facebook were doing nothing to help and that's just plain ol' incorrect.
I mean, I could do a survey, but I'm already convinced.
Stop saying I'm incorrect when you can't know.

It's fair to say "maybe you're incorrect, and you shouldn't get upset without knowing for sure," but it's just as incorrect as you say I am to say they're all def. actually doing important things.
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Old 10-21-2010, 11:24 AM   #4616
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Woah I missed alot....

But I like how Saya put it. It should be seen as support. That not everyone is against you.
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Old 10-21-2010, 11:26 AM   #4617
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I think it's highly likely that you're incorrect and you can't get upset without knowing for sure. You're assumption that those guys do nothing else to help is likely to be more incorrect than me assuming that many or even most of them contribute in some kind of way.
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Old 10-21-2010, 11:41 AM   #4618
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I mean, I could do a survey, but I'm already convinced.
<sarcasm>Quite a healthy, rational outlook you've got there.</sarcasm>

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Stop saying I'm incorrect when you can't know.
When your position is that the vast majority of the 100,000+ people who wore purple yesterday were doing so for disingenuous reasons, I think we can rightly call it an insanely paranoid and misanthropic position.

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It's fair to say "maybe you're incorrect, and you shouldn't get upset without knowing for sure," but it's just as incorrect as you say I am to say they're all def. actually doing important things.
Argumentum ad ignorantiam followed by a classical Strawman in an attempt to reduce my argument to the same level and thus render the entire discussion to an unintelligible mass of contradictions in which nothing can be proven or gained.

We have already shown that:

Even wearing a purple shirt disingenuously and then doing nothing else still has a positive effect, albeit a small one (moral, awareness, simple political statement) and your assertion that these people are categorically, or even mostly just trendy hipsters getting off on "sharing a secret" is straight up insane.

You have stated that you're basing the above conclusion on absolutely NOTHING besides your own prejudices and feelings, and cannot be convinced otherwise because you've already made up your mind.

So yeah, Get fucked by someone who's genital composition you happen to find appealing.
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Old 10-21-2010, 01:16 PM   #4619
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Fruitbat, why do you keep posting lyrics everywhere?
Because I'm stressed to the point of a major flip out and trigger. I figured instead of posting my rant crap on here (which won't do anyone any good) i'd just post the lyrics that summed it up.

Oh and the bicycle lyrics on the other thread was the first song that came into my head when I read what was written - like I said I'm trying really hard not to trigger which explains my randomness - because my mind is going all over the place trying to latch onto something so I won't trigger.

When it happens I'll be lucky to know which way is up - so being responsible for another human being (babybat) when i trigger is not at all good. Last time I triggered I was considering leaping off bridges, diving in front of cars/trucks/buses etc.

I'll hold on until i get out of town then I'll let myself lose it - 11 years of practice with PTSD and being a control freak does help. Plus my high level of responsibility for others makes me extra dumb - I won't do anything because I don't want anyone to have to clean up the mess afterwards.

So there you go.. I'm damaged and dumb.
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Old 10-21-2010, 01:50 PM   #4620
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Fuck best friends for 3 years who suddenly stop talking to you, getting engaged then not giving you a chance to know why they stopped talking to you, also not giving you a chance to say congratulations -because you care-!

Is it weird that I still love and respect that friend (maybe a bit lest respect but I still do) and back them up and feel very happy for them?



Meh
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Old 10-21-2010, 02:02 PM   #4621
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That sucks, have you tried telling them that you feel pushed away?
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Old 10-21-2010, 03:57 PM   #4622
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on the vague note above of causes becoming fashionable- while it's awesome when a cause gets enough momentum to get mainstream attention and fundraising, it's kind of shit when this happens at the expense of other, also valid, causes.

In the UK (and I don't know if this applies to the US), the breast cancer campaigns have raised so much awareness that other cancers are being marginalised- there are tons and tons of facilities and new treatments being developed for breast cancer, but other, more fatal, less fashionable cancers like bowel cancer are falling by the wayside.

Relating to the gay rights thing (again in the UK), the gay/lesbian rights group Stonewall has been campaigning on behalf of gay and lesbian people. All okay so far. But they also presume to advise government on behalf of transsexual and transgendered people and have become the first port of call for quotes and statements on behalf of the TS/TG community, despite not representing them and sometimes even promoting transphobic individuals like Julie Bindel. There are actual charities and groups out there all about the TS/TG community, and they cannot compete because Stonewall has effectively pushed them out in many areas including the influence of governmental policies that directly affect them.

So. Yay for causes getting attention and being able to make more of a difference! Boo for some of those causes then (intentionally or unintentionally) diverting important funding and awareness away from related campaigns that need it just as much.



Totally unrelated to the above, my whining rant is this: Thanks a lot, George Osborne. You've fucked the country worse than Thatcher could have dreamed. A minimum of a million more becoming unemployed within a year thanks to your reforms. No investment. No support for the disabled. No training schemes. No generation of new jobs. You've fucking killed my country, you c*nt. You and Cameron and your Tory mates and your fucking tame poodle Clegg can just fuck right off. Go back to your fucking tax havens and stay out of my government you vicious, unthinking, economically illiterate twats.
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Old 10-21-2010, 11:11 PM   #4623
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Totally unrelated to the above, my whining rant is this: Thanks a lot, George Osborne. You've fucked the country worse than Thatcher could have dreamed. A minimum of a million more becoming unemployed within a year thanks to your reforms. No investment. No support for the disabled. No training schemes. No generation of new jobs. You've fucking killed my country, you c*nt. You and Cameron and your Tory mates and your fucking tame poodle Clegg can just fuck right off. Go back to your fucking tax havens and stay out of my government you vicious, unthinking, economically illiterate twats.
Here Here! Northern Ireland is bracing itself for the most severe cutbacks yet. If I didn't know any better I'd say Osborne doesn't like us.
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Old 10-22-2010, 02:20 PM   #4624
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I tripped and fell on the sidewalk today, and cut and smashed my hand in the process I had to walk home covered in blood, hoping no one assumed I was a serial killer. Its still really stiff and achy, I should probably get off the computer.
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Old 10-22-2010, 06:59 PM   #4625
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Dude what did you fall on?! A machete?!
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