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Politics "Under democracy, one party always devotes its chief energies to trying to prove that the other party is unfit to rule -and both commonly succeed, and are right."
-H.L. Menken |
08-16-2008, 05:25 PM
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#1
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Join Date: Jan 2007
Location: Las Vegas, NV
Posts: 332
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Nanny State
I've been reading this book called Nanny State.
If anyone has read it, what do you think?
Also not to just focus on the book, what do you all think about this type of thing?
What do you think about laws that are put in place to help "protect" people from themselves and others when really they are just overbearing and not needed?
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08-16-2008, 05:37 PM
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#2
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Join Date: Feb 2007
Location: Harlem
Posts: 6,909
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No one should be protected from themselves.
Generally, if one WANTS to self destruct, then let them.
I mother fucking hate... nanny state ideals.
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Not all beliefs and ideas are equal.
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08-16-2008, 05:59 PM
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#3
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Join Date: Mar 2008
Posts: 2,629
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I don't like the idea of anyone telling me what I can and Can't do.
Another Nanny State ideal is to completely disarm anyone that isn't a Police Officer or in the Military.
Then of course you can forget about freedom of speech and other joy's of life.
I like the laws the way they are,in some cases,if the U.S. would leagalize weed it would be even better. (I do not advocate using firearms and smoke together,to much could go wrong)
That and I hate J.B.T.'s (Jack Booted Thugs) in general.
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08-17-2008, 06:46 PM
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#7
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Join Date: Sep 2006
Location: Out of my mind.
Posts: 999
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Deadmanwalking, a double post is considered bad, but acceptable given the 5 minute time limit in editing. A triple post is pushing it, but we can deal. But a quadruple post?
I can agree with laws when they protect both yourself and others. Take Drunk Driving laws for example: They protect yourself from driving and crashing, and they protect others from you becoming a 100km/ph ball of steel. So the dual purpose keeps it good in my book.
But when you're prohibiting alcohol in someone's home, then I have a problem.
__________________
"What have I taken away from you?"
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08-17-2008, 06:56 PM
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#8
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Join Date: Sep 2007
Location: Osaka, Japan
Posts: 1,472
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I have to take an exception to the idea that other rights depend on the right to bear arms, that is some extremely flimsy slippery-slope logic. Japan and western Europe don't seem to be suffering to badly with heavy restrictions on firearms.
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08-17-2008, 07:17 PM
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#9
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Join Date: Feb 2007
Location: Harlem
Posts: 6,909
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Splintered
Deadmanwalking, a double post is considered bad, but acceptable given the 5 minute time limit in editing. A triple post is pushing it, but we can deal. But a quadruple post?
I can agree with laws when they protect both yourself and others. Take Drunk Driving laws for example: They protect yourself from driving and crashing, and they protect others from you becoming a 100km/ph ball of steel. So the dual purpose keeps it good in my book.
But when you're prohibiting alcohol in someone's home, then I have a problem.
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You know how the law of gravity is essentially unbroken? And well... the laws of light and matter?
If drunk driving laws were really laws, they wouldn't be broken. :-/
__________________
No Gods. No Kings.
Not all beliefs and ideas are equal.
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08-17-2008, 07:20 PM
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#10
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Join Date: Sep 2006
Location: Out of my mind.
Posts: 999
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Then no law in the American legal system is a law. Shall we call them rules then?
I'm confused as to what your point is.
__________________
"What have I taken away from you?"
"My irlelaulsiitoyn!."
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08-17-2008, 07:20 PM
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#11
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Join Date: Jan 2007
Location: Las Vegas, NV
Posts: 332
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Splintered
Deadmanwalking, a double post is considered bad, but acceptable given the 5 minute time limit in editing. A triple post is pushing it, but we can deal. But a quadruple post?
I can agree with laws when they protect both yourself and others. Take Drunk Driving laws for example: They protect yourself from driving and crashing, and they protect others from you becoming a 100km/ph ball of steel. So the dual purpose keeps it good in my book.
But when you're prohibiting alcohol in someone's home, then I have a problem.
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But see, in the book it mentioned that the BAC used to be over .08
Then it was downed to .08
Why?
There were even instances where people who had lower than .08 who still got arrested.
What the hell is up with that?
Because they don't want people to drink. PERIOD.
__________________
J.P. Monroe: Jesus Christ!
Pinhead: Not quite.
-Hellraiser 3: Hell On Earth
Pinhead: What you think of as pain is a shadow. Pain has a face. Allow me to show it to you. Gentlemen, I... Am... Pain
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08-17-2008, 07:23 PM
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#12
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Join Date: Sep 2006
Location: Out of my mind.
Posts: 999
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They don't want people to drink and drive. I think that's the operative word.
You can be hammered, and as long as you don't wander on to private property, you can walk wherever you want. To my knowledge, there's nothing illegal about walking and being drunk, or being drunk in a bar/at your home, and you can't be arrested for it.
It's when you operate a motor vehicle that it becomes a problem.
__________________
"What have I taken away from you?"
"My irlelaulsiitoyn!."
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08-17-2008, 07:25 PM
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#13
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Join Date: Feb 2007
Location: Harlem
Posts: 6,909
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Splintered
Then no law in the American legal system is a law. Shall we call them rules then?
I'm confused as to what your point is.
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More of just a rhetorical statement really that laws FAIL us.
__________________
No Gods. No Kings.
Not all beliefs and ideas are equal.
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08-17-2008, 07:31 PM
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#14
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Join Date: Sep 2006
Location: Out of my mind.
Posts: 999
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Quote:
Originally Posted by KontanKarite
More of just a rhetorical statement really that laws FAIL us.
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Good point. However, I don't think laws can/should try to prevent things or make them physically impossible, like the laws of nature do. I think they should provide a means for dealing with events when they happen.
Using the Drunk Driving example, I don't think the law will ever stop someone from getting in the car and driving. However, if they are caught it will provide a means for stopping them from doing it again, or providing penalties when they do crash and kill someone.
__________________
"What have I taken away from you?"
"My irlelaulsiitoyn!."
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08-17-2008, 07:42 PM
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#15
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Join Date: Jan 2007
Location: Las Vegas, NV
Posts: 332
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Splintered
To my knowledge, there's nothing illegal about walking and being drunk, or being drunk in a bar/at your home, and you can't be arrested for it.
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Actually, there were times that police went into bars LOOKING for people that were drunk and to arrest them.
__________________
J.P. Monroe: Jesus Christ!
Pinhead: Not quite.
-Hellraiser 3: Hell On Earth
Pinhead: What you think of as pain is a shadow. Pain has a face. Allow me to show it to you. Gentlemen, I... Am... Pain
-Hellraiser:Bloodline
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08-17-2008, 07:44 PM
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#16
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Join Date: Sep 2006
Location: Out of my mind.
Posts: 999
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Cen0bite
Actually, there were times that police went into bars LOOKING for people that were drunk and to arrest them.
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I've never seen/heard of that happening.
Then again, it may also be in part to where I live, in which case I'd disagree with the police and law.
__________________
"What have I taken away from you?"
"My irlelaulsiitoyn!."
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08-17-2008, 07:49 PM
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#17
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Join Date: Jan 2007
Location: Las Vegas, NV
Posts: 332
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If you'd like, i could find it in the book for you.
__________________
J.P. Monroe: Jesus Christ!
Pinhead: Not quite.
-Hellraiser 3: Hell On Earth
Pinhead: What you think of as pain is a shadow. Pain has a face. Allow me to show it to you. Gentlemen, I... Am... Pain
-Hellraiser:Bloodline
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08-17-2008, 07:52 PM
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#18
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Join Date: Sep 2006
Location: Out of my mind.
Posts: 999
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It's alright. I'll take your word.
However, this is a case where I don't agree with what the police were doing, and to my knowledge that's not the law where I live (Either in the States or in Canada). So I'm not really arguing anything.
__________________
"What have I taken away from you?"
"My irlelaulsiitoyn!."
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08-17-2008, 07:55 PM
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#19
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Join Date: Jan 2007
Location: Las Vegas, NV
Posts: 332
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Yeah.
I feel as though since i've been reading the book, that i should be doing something about it.
Things like this really bother me. Even enough to make me want to move to another country or something.
__________________
J.P. Monroe: Jesus Christ!
Pinhead: Not quite.
-Hellraiser 3: Hell On Earth
Pinhead: What you think of as pain is a shadow. Pain has a face. Allow me to show it to you. Gentlemen, I... Am... Pain
-Hellraiser:Bloodline
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08-17-2008, 07:57 PM
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#20
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Join Date: Feb 2007
Location: Harlem
Posts: 6,909
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Splintered
Good point. However, I don't think laws can/should try to prevent things or make them physically impossible, like the laws of nature do. I think they should provide a means for dealing with events when they happen.
Using the Drunk Driving example, I don't think the law will ever stop someone from getting in the car and driving. However, if they are caught it will provide a means for stopping them from doing it again, or providing penalties when they do crash and kill someone.
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Well... in the name of safety, you could always make that reaction harsher.
Get caught with a DUI, license revoked for a decade. I mean c'mon. If we're going to use fear as a means of keeping people in line and behaving, let's make it worth it. o_0
__________________
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08-17-2008, 08:02 PM
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#21
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Join Date: Sep 2006
Location: Out of my mind.
Posts: 999
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On the other hand, we could not have any recourse for it at all. So therefore there would be no punishment for driving drunk, and no additional punishment for killing someone in a drunk driving incident.
I think there needs to be a reasonable course of action taken, and I do not believe ten years or no penalty is reasonable.
__________________
"What have I taken away from you?"
"My irlelaulsiitoyn!."
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08-18-2008, 07:47 AM
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#22
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Join Date: Jul 2008
Posts: 332
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What is Nany State? It doesn't sound good...
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08-18-2008, 09:38 AM
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#23
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Join Date: Mar 2008
Posts: 2,629
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Check out some of the links I posted .
Those show the beginning of a Nanny State. (They are also about Gun Control,the Nanny State's first stab at "Protecting" us from ourselves)
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08-18-2008, 12:59 PM
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#24
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Join Date: Jan 2007
Location: Las Vegas, NV
Posts: 332
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Well, you could start finding out by reading the book Nanny State by David Harsanyi
__________________
J.P. Monroe: Jesus Christ!
Pinhead: Not quite.
-Hellraiser 3: Hell On Earth
Pinhead: What you think of as pain is a shadow. Pain has a face. Allow me to show it to you. Gentlemen, I... Am... Pain
-Hellraiser:Bloodline
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08-18-2008, 04:56 PM
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#25
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Join Date: May 2007
Posts: 1,419
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Deadmanwalking_05
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Bleh. I guess I would consider the UK a nanny state.
But not because of the firearm laws.
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