Propoganda

[CptSternn]

Found this article today and thought I'd post it here...

Journalists fired for taking gov't money

http://news.**********/s/ap/20060909...ltBHNlYwM3MTY-

MIAMI - Ten South Florida journalists, including three with The Miami Herald's Spanish-language sister paper, received thousands of dollars from the federal government for their work on radio and TV programming aimed at undermining Fidel Castro's communist regime, the Herald reported Friday.

Pablo Alfonso, who reports on Cuba and wrote an opinion column for El Nuevo Herald, was paid almost $175,000 since 2001 to host shows on Radio and TV Marti, U.S. government programs that promote democracy in Cuba, according to government documents obtained by The Miami Herald.

Olga Connor, a freelance reporter who wrote about Cuban culture for El Nuevo Herald, received about $71,000 from the U.S. Office of Cuba Broadcasting, and staff reporter Wilfredo Cancio Isla, who covered the Cuban exile community and politics, was paid almost $15,000 in the last five years, the Herald said.

The newspaper said Alfonso and Cancio were fired and Connor's freelance relationship was severed.

Alfonso and Cancio declined to comment to the Herald. They and Connor did not respond to e-mails seeking comment sent by The Associated Press.

Jesus Diaz Jr., president of the Miami Herald Media Co. and publisher of both newspapers, said the individuals violated a "sacred trust" between journalists and the public.

"I personally don't believe that integrity and objectivity can be assured if any of our reporters receive monetary compensation from any entity that he or she may cover or have covered, but particularly if it's a government agency," Diaz said.

The AP's e-mail and phone messages for Diaz were referred to Robert Beatty, Miami Herald Media's general counsel and vice president of public affairs.

Beatty said the papers' employees have consistently demonstrated a high level of integrity, and that it is their responsibility to disclose any real or perceived conflicts of interest. He told the AP the payments were identified in documents requested under the Freedom of Information Act.

Alberto Mascaro, chief of staff of the U.S. Cuban broadcasting office, confirmed to the AP that all 10 journalists had received payments but said he did not have the details and declined to comment further.

The Herald said it reviewed articles by the three, including several about TV and Radio Marti, and found no mention of the payments.

Pedro Roig, the director of the Office of Cuba Broadcasting, said he made a point to hire more Cuban exile journalists as contractors hoping to improve the news content of the shows. He said it is up to each journalist to follow his or her own ethics and rules.

"We consider them to be good journalists, and people who were formed inside that system who got out (of Cuba) and adapted and made good," Roig said. "In reality, I feel very satisfied."

Other journalists who received payments included Diario Las Americas opinion page editor Helen Aguirre Ferre and reporter/columnist Ariel Remos.

Ferre said she didn't see a conflict of interest, and Remos said he enjoyed the freedom to speak his opinion on the stations.

The journalists are among several accused in recent years of taking money from the government without making those connections clear.

Last year, congressional auditors concluded that the Education Department engaged in illegal "covert propaganda" by hiring columnist Armstrong Williams to endorse the No Child Left Behind Act without requiring him to disclose he was paid.

Another columnist, Maggie Gallagher, had a contract with the Health and Human Services Department to help promote a marriage initiative.

Last year, the Los Angeles Times reported that the Pentagon paid a consulting firm and Iraqi newspapers to plant favorable stories about the Iraq war and rebuilding efforts.

Al Tompkins, a professor at the Poynter Institute for journalism, said journalists are obligated to inform their employers before they accept outside work and must avoid even the appearance of a conflict of interest.

But he added that newspapers are responsible for ensuring that everyone in the newsroom understands their ethical standards.

The Cuban government has long accused the United States of paying South Florida journalists to promote anti-government propaganda.

In an interview broadcast at a Hispanic media convention in June, the head of Cuba's parliament denied that more than two dozen journalists had been imprisoned in his own country for speaking out against the Communist government, saying they were not independent journalists but U.S. agents.

[CptSternn]

Now I know propoganda is a tool of all government and is used by every government worldwide and many groups within various countries.

However, the difference here is that the us government is actively paying new reporters through back-alley deals with ficticious organisations - which right there spells trouble.

If the writers took money directly and we knew they were paid and who is paying them and why, thats one thing. When a government hides that information, and attempts to portray the writers reports as unbias fact, thats when I think they cross a line.

I also think it speaks volumes about the 'cause' they are fighting for or against. If you have to pay reporters to 'see' your views on a topic and write news storeys slanted towards your agenda, while at the same time a truly impartial writer would write storeys that say the exact opposite - well that also speaks volumes.

If you have to pay people to say things they normally wouldn't, then are you really helping the common man or are you furthering an agenda of personal gain?

Thats the question one must ask when they listen to news in america. If you think the bush admin was just funding writers to spew anti-castro rhetoric, your seriously mistaken. It's just the only one they have gotten caught with so far.

[Binkie]

Wow, this is new? Reporters Without Borders has long been financed by the CIA for it's remarks on the Castro regime. The US army pays Iraqi journalists to write articles for them. The German BND actually goes a step further and pays journalists to spy for them domestically. The British used psychological media operations in Northern Ireland. Hell, even the IRA... oh wait, they were too busy murdering babies and lying to the press for free about stuff like "Bloody Sunday" to worry about paying anyone. Point is, this stuff has been going on for a long time. You're just now realizing this?

[CptSternn]

As mentioned I said many do. You once again try and act like I said only america does. If you look at my first line of my first post, you will see that, of course I really think you don't read anything, or probably can't comprehend it. I personally blame that on your poor education system there in america.

But back on topic - any government that has to pay people to 'see' its views, is NOT helping the people.

[Binkie]

Back pedal quick, Sternn! Make it sound like this article totally didn't surprise you despite your clear statements that "differentiate" this instance from everything else. The CIA works abroad through NUMEROUS front organizations to do EXACTLY this kind of stuff, as does the IRGC, BDN, MI:6, GRU, FSB, former IIS, etc. This is NOT new to the world. This is OLD information that you didn't know of before due to your complete lack of any understanding of how the intelligence community and USAID works.

[CptSternn]

Well, if yer such an expert on this, and I have only touched on the tip of the ice berg so to speak here, why not fill us in on the other dirty tricks the cia is responsible for.

I mean, we all know they are responsible for dirty politics, much like the bush admin. But its only recently that they have gotten so sloppy we see the cia ending up on newspapers worldwide.

From bungled kidnapping attempts in Italy, to secret jails in Poland, and now paying off newspapers in america to run storeys for them. All that and we find out they had no intel on Iraq. What a top class organisation. *chuckle*

I remember when the cia actually did this stuff and was accused of it and people just wrote it off as conspiracy theories.

But today we see its not. I guess the cia isn't as stealthy as they used to be? That or people no longer want to help them keep their affairs quite - seeings how a few decades ago people migth have argued their actions were helping the world community, while as now we know that their actions serve benefit a few individuals financially and have no bearing on freedom in america.

[Binkie]

Why don't you actually go learn this shit yourself? Like everyone else, you need to actually go make an effort to actually learn.

And again, your remarks spew idiocy. The CIA has always been about serving America's interests, not helping the World community. This is evident by the coup to keep the Shah in power in Iran, keeping a very unpopular president in power in the south of Vietnam, supporting terrorists in Nicaragua to fight a freely elected government, etc. If you think the entire Cold War was about "making the world a better place," it wasn't. News flash: it was entirely about control.

[CptSternn]

Well there you go. A self serving organisation that values life outside the us as 'collateral' while at the same time claiming to be saving lives worldwide - by killing those who are not american.

I forgot that part in the Bible - you know the book bush is always talking about - where they said kill every one who disagrees with america, because thats ok.

[Binkie]

You've already demonstrated in this thread your complete lack of knowledge for how the intelligence community works. Just pretending to know anything about it by some desperate attempt to sound like Ted Rall is pathetic. If you have something serious in nature you want to talk about, cite something relevant to the topic here.

[Darkbender423]

I believe that the simple fact of the matter is that all governments in all contries practice promoting their own agenda and will stop at nothing to accomplish their goals. Every country uses their media to spread their bullshit across the face of their country and the world. I think if we as citizens of the world truely wish to be free we must choose not to buy into the lies and deceit that flies from the mouths of those who wish to gain control over us. The news is full of lies, they twist the events of history to fit into the little box they have designed.

There is a lot of underhanded shit going on out there and only the enlightenment of the people will force the necessary changes that need to be made in the world. Evolution of our species will eventually led us out of the darkness. In this country the NSA runs things, we use the CIA on foriegn soil, but they are all involved in butchering the truth. The truth being that we are all being held prisoner to the politics to keep us enslved to systems that seek to destroy the true spiritual and enlightened nature of mankind. We are all the same, we simply live in different parts of the world. Everyone is born free and then consumed by whatever force it is that rules their little part of the world. I personally do not buy into any of it, I try hard to see beyond what is being fed to me.

We live in a world that is being torn apart by war, lies deceit and religious persecution. Every country wants the world to believe they are living the right way. Every religion claims to be the true way. All these people delude us with mass propaganda to keep us from seeing the truth that we are all one. We are all connected on a level that transends this mundane world, politics, religion and conflict. Free your mind to what is really going on around you and forget all that is being forced on you.

Certainly there are a lot of sneeky things going on behind the closed doors of politicans and religious leaders of our world and it will not end any time soon. Governments thrive on propaganda and misinformation, it is simply a product of their own deluded minds, it is a tool and they use it to gain strength. I say we take that strength away from them by not buying into it!!! Believe what you know to be the truth and not what you are being told is the truth!!! There is no honor in war, genocide, esponiage or the decay of the human spirit!!!

[CptSternn]

DarkBender -

Good post, and yes, in some ways I would agree however, if you look at most governments, you will see this is not the case. This is the view you may get living within the states, but you will find outside the states people and their governments are much more relaxed, transparent, and do not engage in such outrageous activities.

[Binkie]

Such is obvious with Iran, China, Kazakhstan, Germany, Russia, North Korea, Poland, Ukraine, Egypt, Sudan, Libya, etc. The list goes on an on.

Once again you demonstrate that you lack knowledge on not only US matters, which is all you seem to care about, but global matters as well. You need to branch out and actually learn about other countries in the world besides the US if you're going to try to use global politics as a basis for your arguements. Just a suggestion. Oh yeah, you may want to learn about the US as well. That, or just stick with reading the "funnies" everyday.

[Darkbender423]

I have to agree with Blinkie, this is a global problem, I don't think that any country has a government that is so transperant that the public can actually see all that is taking place behind closed doors. Every country has some level of political corruption and secrets. There is unrest in every society. I don't agree with many of the decisions that are made by the leaders of my country. Even with all the secrets and lies that take place it is very transparent if you are aware enough of your surroundings to see what is really going on. Do you truely believe that your country does not engage in esponiage? Great Brittan has the SAS and other factions that conduct world wide espionage, every country has some faction. Perhaps the wool has been pulled so far over your eyes that you are not able to see and therefore believe that things are so much better in other place. These are global problems and there is no escaping that!! Certianly countries with more world influence conduct these activities on a greater scale to promote their "cause". Hence the term "super power". If you pretend that it isn't taking place then your are simply deluding yourself. I can't say that I agree with the reason we are at war with Iraq right now, there were mistakes made. I do however believe that Sadam is a creature of evil who has commited atrocities beyond anything I would ever care to know of. In my opion we should have taken him out of power long ago simply because of human rights violations. The entire world knew what he was doing to the citizens of his country and no one stood up and said no. All the war could have been averted by a single bullet 20 years ago before things could errode to the chaos that we now have there. I am 37 years old and I have watched the evolution of what is now taking place. Who stood up for all the women and children that have been murdered and beheaded for ignorant reasons. The same things are happening in Rowanda as we sit by and do nothing. There is no reason for it, people should be free to live and thrive in the world. Our planent has provided us with all we need, no one should ever be hungry, or plauged, or without clean water, or subject to living in fear of death because of there beliefs, the color of their skin or the orign of their birth. I cannot say that it is right for any country to act as the "worlds police force", it takes all countries working together and finding a common understanding that transcends political or religious understanding and evolves into a humane understanding to meet the needs of everyone equally. Granted this is not an easy task and I don't pretend to have the answer to solve the worlds problems. We are all in this together like it or not. Knowledge is power.

[Binkie]

Originally Posted by Darkbender423

Knowledge is power.

I always liked the quote that took that a bit further in saying, "The purpose of education is not knowledge, but action."

But at any rate, I agree with the last sentiment you touched on alot. The United Nations, essentially the world court, is a defunct organization in this day an age. Alot of issues that are widely agreed upon are largely ignored if compliance isn't just a friendly, "OK." The crisis in Darfur has been going on for far too long as resolution after resolution are filed (in which prominent security coucil members abstain - another major issue I have), calling for action and nothing is done while people are massacred in an age old cycle that's been going on internally in Sudan since the 80s.

[CptSternn]

...and with how many dying each year? Tens of thousands? And where is the us in all this? Oh yeah, they don't have any oil.

So in a country where ten times the number of people are dying, and still dying, the american government does nothing.

Then invades Iraq to 'premote democracy' and remove Sadaam, for crimes he allegedly committed decades ago.

Goes to show what the true intentions are when you look at situtations like Sudan.

There was a great politcal cartoon in the Sun a few weeks ago that had all these men on their knees holding their wrists in the air as their hands had been cut off, blood pouring from them, and a wee bubble out of one mans head saying 'I wish our country had oil so someone would save us'.

That says it all.

[Binkie]

Actually, the US was the one of the first nations to make a big deal out of the situation in Darfur by calling it "genocide." Bush was one of the few people that even brought up Darfur in the UN this week while everyone else was yacking about their own internal affairs. The US has actually led the charge into trying to get a UN force deployed there for the last two years, but Khartoum consistantly says, "No."

Little learning leason here though for ya, Sternn, since I know you lack worldly knowledge on foreign affairs; Iran and Sudan are close allies. This is why many Western powers will opt not to throw ground forces into a UN peacekeeping force. Much like with the Cold War, if Western ground troops were present, militias trained and equipt by the Qods Force would suicide bomb and attack these targets like crazy at Tehran's request. Again, I suggest you go out and try to learn a bit more about this rather than relying on what you pretend to know or read out of a comic strip. The US is ready at this very moment to send in air support, logistics, and provide the necessary equipment to support troops on the ground in Darfur - not to mention humanitary aid.

But yes, thanks for making this about the US. What do you have to say on behalf of China and Russia? They both have a consistant track record of abstaining from voting on any action to take place there.

[Darkbender423]

Sternn, it is obvious that you have been force fed all the anti-US propaganda that there is and you've digested every bit of it. We are not a nation of war mongers, rascists, power hungry madmen or any of that. The people who live here are compassionate, caring and for the most part peaceful. You should come live here for awhile and find out for yourself what we are truely all about. Does it not sicken you to know of all the atrocities that are happening all over the world. Do you not value freedom and world peace? Certian actions have to meet certian situations. I don't condone war by any means, but I detest genocide and the butchering of innocents who merely wish to live in freedom. Remember a little thing called World War 2, all of you would be speaking German right now if not for the aid of the US. It has to stop someplace. We are the most powerful nation on the face of the planet from a military and humanitarian point of view. We have done more to help other nations than any other country. What has your country done to help the situations that we are discussing here? What aid have they lent to ease the suffering? People focus so much on how we bully the world and they fail to realize all the countries that enjoy the freedom that our citizens have laid down their lives to provide. They fail to comment on the starving and sick children that enjoy full bellies and healthy lives because of the aid we provide. Things are always so twisted against us. You want to talk of propaganda? Choke on it!!!

[CptSternn]

DarkBender -

Your a right wing idiot. America is a crimal regime that has so far killed 20,000+ innocent civilians in Iraq. Trying to equate it to WW2 is the same tripe the bush admin is now trying to sell.

I too detest the killing of innocent civilians. The united states has a fondness for it.

Speaking of WW2 - how many tens of thousands of innocents did america kill when they bombed Japan? Is that not a terrorist act?

[Darkbender423]

Sterrn, you don't know the first thing about me, I'm one of the most liberal and open minded people you can meet. I too detest the killing of innocent people. The killing of anyone for that matter. Murder is murder no matter how you dress it up. My point is that you are so diluded by all the headlines. Think for yourself and don't believe everything you read. If we are talking about proraganda here, the place to start looking is the headlines. The media is the machine that feeds the monster.

My comment about WWII is simply to state that when the world is need of someone to stand up for freedom, America is always there fighting for it. I am not even a Bush supporter, but I do support our troops and I do believe in my country and I believe in the fundemental human right for people to live free and free of fear, persecution and hate. It is a sad fact that innocent people are killed in war, that's why they call it war. It is a sad state of affairs and I truely wish we were not involved in it, but we are. I would love nothing more than to see the world living and working together in peace and harmony. I don't believe Bush has done the right things for this country, nor do I believe that he is the best leader for our nation. In fact I haven't seen a candidate in my life time that I feel is best we have to offer. Our system is in need of some serious reform, but I will not betray my country and I will not turn on the fight for freedom.

It is so easy for you to sit back on your ass and talk of all the innocent people that are being killed while spouting off some numbers that you have gotten from some article or another. Truthfully you don't know how many have been killed, you only know what you are being told. You are in essence feeding into the propaganda machine. I detest war and I destest genocide. Where do we draw the line and say enough is enough? Should we withdraw all our troops and leave all those innocent people to face the death squads and the moral police? There is no easy answer on the subject. There is so much hate and evil in our world and it has to end somewhere. Yes my government has made mistakes and Mr Bush's reign is nearly over, for that I am glad, the guy is an idiot and I don't see how he ever had the intelligence to get where he is. But I do support my country and I don't feel we are evil as you claim we are. I think our intentions in the world are to help people to live in freedom. But there will always be casualties in any conflict. I hope it will all end soon.

In fact I don't think we have enough freedom in this country or in the world for that matter. I don't have the answers to solve the problems of the world, I wish I did, then we would all live as brothers and sisters without conflict or war. My country, your country they would all be meaningless and the focus would be on the welfare of the human race and not in such narrow terms. To call me right wing is laughable. Come spend some time with me if you like, you can stay at my house, see how I live, learn what I value, understand I view things. You would then see that you are wrong about me. I simply don't like all the bashing of my country. We do deasrve a certian amount of it and I understand this. But I do believe that Iraq needed change, simply on human rights violations alone. I've followed the events there for over 20 years now and it turns my stomach to think of the things that were going on under the reign of Sadam. How many innocents did he kill? How many beautiful women lost there heads in the soccer feild? How many executed by death squads? How many gassed with chemical agents? Do you have those numbers?

[Binkie]

Originally Posted by CptSternn

I too detest the killing of innocent civilians. The united states has a fondness for it.

Like when the IRA killed babies with bombs? This is a real question since you've been a staunch defender of the IRA's tatics in murdering innocent civilians. It'd kind of make you a HYPOCRITE if you made the above statement without also condemning the IRA.

[nuksaa]

The united states has a fondness for it.

Because the EU is so squeeky clean in their support of Darwin's Nightmare.

[CptSternn]

Binkie -

Show me how many 'babies' have been killed by the IRA. Please, go ahead. Let me help you...

http://cain.ulst.ac.uk/

They have a complete list of everyone ever killed in the troubles, their names, locations, family information and more. You will see NO babies were every killed. In 30 years of conflict, not one

How many babies have died since bush invaded Iraq? How many bombs dropped by the us have killed babies, children, and women in Iraq?

Red Cross estimates over HALF of the 29,000 innocent civilians killed so far in Iraq are WOMEN and CHILDREN. In a matter of 3 years the united states has killed more women and children than Sadaam has EVER been accused of.

DarkBender -

So you are arguing two things here, please move this to the Iraq thread, but I will say this so you have something to post there -

1. You are arguing that Sadaam had to be removed. The Iraqis are quite capable of handling themselves. If you don't believe me, then why is it that the us hasn't stopped the insurgency? Because the PEOPLE are fueling it. If the PEOPLE wanted to remove Sadaam, they would have. The us can't handle guerilla fighters and neither could Sadaam, had the people wanted to rise up, they would have.

2. Your now 'police' helping the people? Thats the EXACT same tripe the brits claim about Northern Ireland. If they leave, all us animals will tear each other apart. Good to know that your not just occupying a nation and stealing its resources, but your there to 'help'. Note this: Iraq has been around and written about in the early pages of the Old Testement. To think your nation, only what 200 years old some how knows how to run a country better than them is a slap in the face to say the least. Not to mention the fact once again, the PEOPLE are rising up to fight you.

You are the one falling vicitim to the media hype they spew in the states. I know, I watch European news AND us news - its like night and day. Only difference is here, we have the OPTION to watch other news while there you get what - CNN, FOX, and your local news which is controled by one of three networks? Thats IT. We have a dozen news channels from a dozen countries that give many aspects and views here - all of which contridict 90% of what you see on the us news channels.

SO before you starting telling people 'you have to invade' because life was so bad there - ask yourself, how many Iraqisd have you spoken with? Me? I speak to many as I do community work with the many refugees we take in because the us is BANNING all Iraqs from going to thier country. So all the refugees are being displaced all over Europe. Same with Afghanistan.

Also, sort of off topic, but I will be responding less as of next week because I am moving on site to help in the struggle against big oil here in Ireland. I'll start another thread on that as well.

[Binkie]

Originally Posted by CptSternn

Binkie -

Show me how many 'babies' have been killed by the IRA. Please, go ahead. Let me help you...

http://cain.ulst.ac.uk/

They have a complete list of everyone ever killed in the troubles, their names, locations, family information and more. You will see NO babies were every killed. In 30 years of conflict, not one

Why thank you, Sternn. You basically gave me the site that you trust (so we can get your "that source is wrong" arguement out of the way) to prove you wrong. Welp, here's the part of that site that doesn't cite the fact that babies were amongst the dead attributed to the Republicans of Northern Ireland:

http://cain.ulst.ac.uk/events/omagh/dead.htm

Breda Devine was 20 months old and Maura Monaghan was 18 months old when a 500 lb car bomb took both of their lives in the name of the Irish Republican movement.

Any other propaganda you want to unsuccessfully throw my way?

Now that that is out of the way, I'd like a simple answer on whether or not that is worthy of condemning. Was it justifiable to kill those two babies, along with an 8 year old and a 12 year old?

[CptSternn]

Those were not IRA deaths, if you look the Omagh bomb was rIRA - although a similar name, they are a totally different group. Claiming they are the same is like the bush administration claiming Sadaam, a Sunni, back Al Queda, Shiites.

Once again, you leave out pertinant facts and try to skew the true reality to fit your own arguements, but once again your 100% wrong.

[Binkie]

The rIRA is comprised of "former" pIRA members. It's actually about the same as claiming Hezbollah and the Islamic Jihad are one in the same. In case you are completely unfamiliar with the relationship between the two, here's a Wiki article:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Islamic_Jihad

But still you have yet to answer a simple "yes" or "no" question. Do you condemn the Irish Republican bombing that took the lives of these babies?