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Old 03-22-2006, 08:54 PM   #1
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Father wants to "opt out" of parenthood

On a late-night news magazine show, a story was run about a man who accidentally fathers a child, and is very upset about having to pay child support to his ex-girlfriend, claiming he never wanted children, and that he should have the right to choose not to be a father.

The mother has sued him for child support, so he hired a lawyer, and is counter-suing her, claiming that she told him she could not get pregnant. The lawyer calls the case "Roe V Wade for Men," stating that his client should have the option to "opt out" of fatherhood, since it was never his intention to have a child. He says if women have the option to terminate a pregnancy if they do not wish to become parents, why should men be "forced" to be fathers if they don't want to be.

The man stated that the woman claimed to be infertile, and that in addition, she was on birth control pills for medical reasons (the show didn't say what condition she had, but birth control pills are often prescribed for endometriosis). He claims that they discussed the fact that they did not want children, and that even if they wanted them, she couldn't get pregnant so it was not an issue. They had unprotected sex, and she became pregnant, and decided to keep the baby.

I think the man is being selfish. Sure he didn't plan to have children, but sometimes things happen that we can't control. We have to adapt to our circumstances and take responsibility for our actions. Sure he is right. It isn't fair. But that's what this is all about- he is whining about "life is not fair" and he believes that just because he wants to do as he pleases, the child he fathered should grow up without a father, and without enough financial support. Hopefully the child will inherit more of the mother's genes, and not grow up to be a selfish ass. It is probably better for her that her father has chosen to pretend she doesn't exist.

The person who I watched the show with disagreed with me. He said that the man has every right to decide not to participate in this child's life, since he previously made it clear to the woman that he didn't want children. He believes that since the woman told him she couldn't have children, and didn't want them, then it is her sole responsibility to raise this child, because he already stated how he felt about the matter. They had an agreement, and she went back on her word and decided to have a child. So he should not be forced to be a father.
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Old 03-22-2006, 09:04 PM   #2
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When you abort a fetus, it's over. There is no child. So there is no responsibility from either party.

But if the child is born, that's totally different. Somebody has to take care of it. If the father decides to "abort" his parental duties, then who pays for the child if the mother is not financially stable? The taxpayers? It's not fair to the man who doesn't want to be a father, that's for sure. But what else can be done?
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Old 03-22-2006, 09:24 PM   #3
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You'd think so, but somehow it fails to make the "top ten" list. So we have underfed, dirty, uneducated, freezing kids out there, but the powers that be think everything is ok as long as they don't have bruises, broken bones, or a drug addiction.
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Old 03-22-2006, 09:47 PM   #4
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If the parents want to give the child up for adoption, they can do that. But if the mother wants to keep it, the state doesn't have any right to take her child away just because she's poor. That's why all of us with jobs pay so much SSI tax. That is why I think this father is a selfish p.o.s. for not being responsible for his child, accidental or not. Because who pays for it if he decides not to? Us.

I think it is kind of shitty of the mother to sue the father, though. She knows he didn't want a child, and they are no longer together. I have a good friend in a similar situation: the father has "disappeared" and the little girl has never met her father. The mother is too proud to ask him for anything, so she is raising the child on her own.
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Old 03-22-2006, 10:02 PM   #5
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The government doesn't pay. Who do you think pays the government for social programs like Child Welfare Services, WIC, Food Stamps, Social Security, etc.? That money gets taken out of our paychecks every week! The government doesn't just have this surplus of money that they can give out without getting it from taxpayers first.

Now, I am not against welfare for people who have disabilities and seriously need help, but I am not ok with paying for a child just because the father (who in this case happens to be a computer programmer) just "doesn't feel like" having a kid and paying for it! He can afford a kid, and if he was serious about not having children, he should have gotten a vasectomy, or at least been a complete nazi about condoms.

Maybe he should sue the birth control pill company, or the doctor that told his girlfriend she couldn't get pregnant. Oh- they have disclaimers for that. Birth Control Pills are listed as 99.9% effective, so if you get pregnant, you can't sue.
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Old 03-23-2006, 08:47 AM   #6
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In Ireland, we have a social system where everyone gets something if they need it, forever. Solves this issue. I mean, if your unemployed you get the dole. This is also true in the UK and Australia. You can claim until you die without issue. If you work a job that pays under the national average (what the US might call the 'poverty line') you get a check every week as well that keeps you up with the national average. That way no one is poor. If you have a kid, then they give you more money. No deadbeat dads here as the government foots the bill eitherway. It is rare to find a girl with a child who doesn't have a father activly involved in their life. Even ex's after a breakup will act nice around each other to keep the kid happy - and since money is taken out of the equation, there is never any fuss about funding and there is no cold, poor, hungry children.

Also this eliminates the whole 'opt-out' argument. I mean, would any man really choose not to be a father if they knew it wouldn't cost them any money?

Like I said before, just one of many things that can be accomplished if you spend yer money on people and not bombs.
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Old 03-23-2006, 01:08 PM   #7
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I want to move to Ireland! I wonder if they'll accept me as "political refugee" from America?
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Old 03-23-2006, 01:10 PM   #8
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You might joke about that, but as I mentioned before, hundreds of US troops have gone AWOL from Shannon airport during layovers on their way to Iraq, and thats exactly what they file with the government to let them stay.
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Old 03-23-2006, 01:21 PM   #9
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Personally, I see it as fair for the guy if he made it expressly clear from the start that he in no way wanted children. Women can have abortions because it's 'their body', why can't a man refuse to be a father?
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Old 03-23-2006, 01:24 PM   #10
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Of course it's not fair to the guy if he has to pay for the kid, but it's not fair to the kid if the father just gets to decide not to be her dad, or pay for her clothing, food, etc. Like I said before, if he was so serious about not wanting children, he should have had a vasectomy, or at least worn a condom.
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Old 03-23-2006, 01:28 PM   #11
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Maybe STD's? I always think that's a good reason for a condom.
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Old 03-23-2006, 01:35 PM   #12
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Well, that's his argument. He says that she "tricked" him into getting her pregnant because she didn't insist on a condom, and told him she couldn't get pregnant anyway, so he didn't have to use one.

I think he's partially right. But I still think he still has the obligation to the child, since he did actually father her, accidentally or not. It isn't fair, but it's still his responsibility.

If this case sets a legal precedent, dead-beat dads everywhere will gain the legal right to abandon their financial responsibilities to their children. Thousands of single mothers who were previously just scraping by with child support will have to go on welfare, and we will have to pay more out of our paychecks for social security, while guys will worry less about getting women pregnant because they will know it won't affect them in the future.
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Old 03-23-2006, 06:14 PM   #13
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I am so proud to be from the town where this bastard lives.
That is not his choice and he has to take responsibility for his actions.
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Old 03-23-2006, 06:17 PM   #14
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Quote:
Originally Posted by bunnicula
I want to move to Ireland! I wonder if they'll accept me as "political refugee" from America?
Go! My grandparents own a bar there (not that that is of any relevance, here) and it is a beautiful country full of wonderfully fun people.
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Old 03-24-2006, 01:32 AM   #15
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Why not wear a condom? Why not insist on a condom? Yeah, like you people have ever been in 'that' situation. You know the one. Come home from the club with a hottie, can't even get yer tongue out of their mouth while you strip so you both do the hop on one leg while trying to pull yer boots off and still stay attached at the mouth, hop into bed kicking all yer cd's, clothes, and whatever else in the floor, and then the question pops up (along with other things...) '

Do you have a condom?

Umm...no.

*More kissing, more kissing*

Aahhh...fuck it....
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Old 03-24-2006, 06:56 AM   #16
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If you tell someone that you cannot get pregnant, if you tell someone you do not want to get pregnant, and then you do get pregnant and you keep the child, forcing the other party who you deceived is by no means justifiable.

That's like me saying okay, we have $20,000 stashed away together. Let's go test drive a car. We're not going to buy the car, we're just going to test drive it to see what it's like. You leave, I spend your money on the car because I decide I want it.

There's grounds for a lawsuit there. There's grounds for a lawsuit here.
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Old 03-24-2006, 08:11 AM   #17
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I just hope the kid comes out of this okay...
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Old 03-24-2006, 08:30 AM   #18
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It'd certainly make it difficult on Father's Day.

Sorry. That was flippant.

How was your break, Xnguela?
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Old 03-24-2006, 08:45 AM   #19
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Glad you had a good one!

I think we call it Reading Week over here. Which is such a misnomer!
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Old 03-24-2006, 10:15 AM   #20
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It's sad that parenthood and abortion in the states hinges on a mans personal finances.

'Thanks for the Fathers Day card son! You know, funny storey, yer old man got laid off right when Mam got preggers, but luckily I found a new job quick or you would have been a brown stain in the doctors office!'
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Old 03-24-2006, 04:55 PM   #21
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[quote]
Quote:
Originally Posted by angleangel_doom
Go! My grandparents own a bar there (not that that is of any relevance, here) and it is a beautiful country full of wonderfully fun people.
Cool! My family is from Co. Tipperary but I have never been to Ireland. My aunt went there and took pictures of our old ancestral home, and it is abandoned and in disrepair. I hope someday I can move there and fix up the house.
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Old 03-24-2006, 04:59 PM   #22
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[quote]
Quote:
Originally Posted by Disfunction
If you tell someone that you cannot get pregnant, if you tell someone you do not want to get pregnant, and then you do get pregnant and you keep the child, forcing the other party who you deceived is by no means justifiable.

That's like me saying okay, we have $20,000 stashed away together. Let's go test drive a car. We're not going to buy the car, we're just going to test drive it to see what it's like. You leave, I spend your money on the car because I decide I want it.

There's grounds for a lawsuit there. There's grounds for a lawsuit here.
That is true. Like I have said before- It's very unfair to the "father." And pure logic would tell you that the man was in the right. But the reality is that a baby has been born, and must be taken care of. What kind of person would put their finances before the life of a person who they helped create? A human being is not "property" that can be fought over in court, like a $20,000 car. There is more to this case that who is right or wrong, in the logical or fair sense.
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Old 03-24-2006, 07:45 PM   #23
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But helping the kid would have to be solely the decision of the father, not a responsibility.
It's sad if the father didn't want to do anything with his kid, but the entire fault falls upon the mother. These circumstances look more like if the woman had gone to a sperm bank more than the man left her pregnant.
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Old 03-25-2006, 12:07 PM   #24
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Quote:
Originally Posted by CptSternn
Why not wear a condom? Why not insist on a condom? Yeah, like you people have ever been in 'that' situation. You know the one. Come home from the club with a hottie, can't even get yer tongue out of their mouth while you strip so you both do the hop on one leg while trying to pull yer boots off and still stay attached at the mouth, hop into bed kicking all yer cd's, clothes, and whatever else in the floor, and then the question pops up (along with other things...) '

Do you have a condom?

Umm...no.

*More kissing, more kissing*

Aahhh...fuck it....
That's a good way to catch an STD.
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Old 03-25-2006, 01:48 PM   #25
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On one hand, the dad is right. Maybe, he's not ready to have baby. What the mother did was very wrong, I believe she should be sued. On the other hand, it is his child after all. How will he be able to give up on a human being from his own blood or punish the carrier of his child. Ths is one tough situation which is certainly not easy to handle.
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