goth history

[heretoday_gonetomorrow]

Alright, I'd like to know, how did this all come about? What's the history behind "goth"? The music, the clothes, where'd it come from? Anybody got good resources they could direct me to, or some knowledge of your own to share?

[Cyntrox]

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gothic_subculture

[Renatus]

You gotta love wikipedia really.

[heretoday_gonetomorrow]

I was going to go there first...but I've been told some wikipedia stuff isn't so reliable. Will be sure to read the Wikipedia page.

[Cyntrox]

I read some of it now, and what I've seen seems correct.

[Renatus]

just don't trust things like a doctor's credentials, they tend to keep their facts straight most of the time. Though somtimes some losers get in the mix and mess some of the things up, they fix stuff like that pretty quick.

[Vyvian Blackthorne]

Goth is a music based subculture founded in 1979 with the formation of the most notable goth rock band to date, Bauhaus. Goth emerhed from a fusion of both punk and glam, yet with a darker, more brooding and melancholy sound and vocal style. It was first labeled 'postive punk'-as it was too dark to be considered glam, and not aggressive enough to be considered punk. Although Bauhaus is considered the first gothic rock band (the term goth was used by postive punk bands such as UK Decay, which is suprising to some fans of 2nd/3rd generation goth work) two years prior was the formation of Siouxsie and the Banshees, whose fashion (mainly from Siouxsie) became the highlighted symbol for goth fashion to date. Goth fashion can be used as a symbol to represent the feelings of alienation and understanding society's flaws to accept the world for what it really is. Joy Division, though a soully post-punk band, influenced goth as far as themes. Yet the lead singer Ian Curtis commited suicide ironically as the movement of goth began.
GOTHIC, The term as mentioned eariler was used to describe the music, with the release of the Bauhaus single 'Bela Lugosi's Dead'-which was a haunting and stark record that forever changed the asesthics of music. With this, more Gothic rock bands emerged and soon came the subgenre of deathrock, and the Batcave in London. The origins of the term goth or gothic may have came from British goth rock band SexGang Children, in which the lead Singer, Andi Sexgang, had lived in a town called Visigoth. He was nicknamed gothic goblin by Ian Asturbury of his early gothic rock band, Southern Death Cult (later to go through unnessecary name changes and looks), and thus the term goth was used to describe his fans. The Batcave, an old goth nightclub, in London is considered the birth place of the goth subculture itself. Though positive punk, neo punk, and other terms were first used to describe goth. Bands like Specimen, Alien Sex Fiend, and SexGang Children are notables at the Batcave. Meanwhile, goth in America was given its own, often perferred term, Deathrock. Deathrock (a mixture of punk and goth) is often seen nowadays as the stereotyped image for goth, with the DIY work, ripped fishnets, teased hair, black lipstick and painted finger nails, etc. despite not given any mainstream success. Deathrock was a term used to describe horror themed novelty songs in the 50s, yet it had an entirely different meaning. Aside from this, Kommunity FK is considered the band to have invented deathrock, yet what is often misconcieved as the first Deathrock band is Christian Death.
Goth's image was seen a wide range in the eighties with the post punk holocaust drawing to a near end. With post punk's storytelling ability and elements of Glam with the fashion used from Fetish such as bands like the Cramps, Goth still remained underground in both England and the United States. Germany was begining to see the beauty and image of goth as well with Xmal Duetshland (excuse if I've mispelled)...However, Goth central is cited both in London and Los Angeles. With this, Goth's gloomy aesthic and sound (which consisted of a wide range of ochestras, bass guitars, psychobilly sounding riffs, and even acoustic sounds) was becoming familar to the mainstream with its stunning apperances. Memorable 80s cinema displayed a positive place for goth in its time period, beginning with the 1983 Vampire film THe Hunger in which gothfathers Bauhaus perfomed their single 'Bela Lugosi's Dead'-in a nightclub in the opening scene. The styles featured in the film The Hunger have in real-life influneced current goth fashion (such as the useage of sunglasses, Ankhs, black clothing of course, etc.) the film also featured the largest pre-goth advocate, David Bowie.
Goth, by the early-mid eighties, had a generation of music, called the second wave of Goth rock. Fields of the Nephillim, The Mission, Danse Society, Play Dead, and the Sisters of Mercy, are notable acts of the 2nd wave of goth rock. The mark of this is cited when Bauhaus broke up in 1983, however, this was also the time that goth divorced itself from punk moreso and became its own style and genre. After Bauhaus disembanded, former members such as Daniel Ash and David J, played in simply tagged 'Alt. Rock' bands such as Tones on Tail and Love and Rockets. Peter Murphy, the singer, persued his own successful solo career. As the second wave of gothic rock emerged in the United Kingdom, Deathrock was still fresh in the United States. The most prolific deathrock artist to date is, most definatley, Rozz Williams. Other than forming Christian Death, he had also associated with other considerably dark punk rock bands and even his own side project, the goth rock band Shadow Project (along with his soon to be wife, Eva O). Rozz Williams is along with Patrik of Kommunity FK, considered the founders of American goth rock and style.
Goth style, as far as fashion, is hard to determine where the origin of the fashion started. Many elements of stolen from Punk, as some other elements are taken from Victorian fashions as well as Fetish fashion (fishnets, leather, etc.). Though the aesthic of goth fashion should be clear with its beautiful appereance. Black can be cited as a colour of indiuvality, outcast-ness ;p, or something that absords...So in short, I will say simply that Goth is beautiful and a way of life. It emerged from a musical genre, yet the idelogy can be described as timeless.

Goth Forever

[Cyntrox]

Holy... Did you just type all that out yourself?

[Vyvian Blackthorne]

Originally Posted by Cyntrox

Holy... Did you just type all that out yourself?

Good goth I'm tired. Yes I did...hopefully I did it right...

Goth Forever

[heretoday_gonetomorrow]

^_^ You guys are amazing, 'specially you Blackthorne, can't believe you typed all of that. Thank you. What it really means to be goth is much better than anything I've ever thought it was. Absolutely loved the new knowledge gained. Can't wait to look into some gothic style bands. I want to read "The Castle of Ontranto" as well...

[KontanKarite]

What's freaky is that I don't think Vyvian has blown his proverbial load on goth yet. 0_0

[raggedyanne]

Vyvian has too much pent up information and to slow a typing style. Amazing post. I think I learned more about goth from Vyvian in my time on this site than anywhere else.

[Cicero]

This is going to sound pedantic, but in regard to Vyvian's rather astoundingly accurate history (at least by my own knowledge): Andi Sexgang lived in an apartment building called the Visigoth Towers in Brixton, not a town called Visigoth. And Dave Vanian probably deserves a mention in credit for the gothic aesthetic - he started dressing like a vampire in the mid 70's, and was a definite inspiration for future gothic fashion.

Other than that though... that history deserves an A+.

[Draconysius]

Thank you for typing that Vyvian. Now I don't have to. ^,..,^

[Draconysius]

Though I'd say the fashion sense emerged out of how some of the goth or proto-goth bands dressed. Siouxsie is an enormous influence on goth fashion, not just for her teased hair, but for her tendency to wear bondage gear. the Damned, one of the earliest punk bands ever, also one of the first punk bands to go goth, also had a spooky fashion sense. T.S.O.L. were the same way. They dressed in a horrifying fashion a good but before the goth movement even started, and when it did start, both bands were lumped into the genre because of their sound. Also, don't forget Lou Reed (of the Velvet Underground)'s dark fashion sense. Covered in leather and vinyl, black fingernails, skinny and pale complexion... the works. I'd say all those people had an influence on the fashion.

[heretoday_gonetomorrow]

^_^ Siouxsie, looks awesome.

[Vyvian Blackthorne]

Good goth...thank you guys so very much for that accliam and clarfication. Goth is, I must say without hestitation, my passion. And yeah, I confused Andi's location, it was noticable I didn't get into much details. I should have also credited the Damned, though I did always consider them a goth band in the first place so I apologize for that flaw.

G'ep Ed, I did it for youa111eleven111 I guess it's easy to tell I began typing the moment the thread opened...

Goth Forever

[Minyaliel]

This is the site I used when I wrote my final exam on musical subcultures (taking goth as a modern day example) for a history of goth. I think it's wonderful... http://www.scathe.demon.co.uk/histgoth.htm

[Draconysius]

I've written a (so far) three-part essay on the goth subculture, starting with its history, moving into my personal beginnings and what it means to be goth, and then speaking of the modern state of goth. If I get enough requests, I'd be happy to post it here for you guys to read. *nudge nudge*

[Seraphynth]

Vyvian, that was an amazing thing to type out.
Very informative. :]

[Vyvian Blackthorne]

Originally Posted by Seraphynth

Vyvian, that was an amazing thing to type out.
Very informative. :]

Good goth, you're very welcome :-)


Goth Forever

[Seraphynth]

Originally Posted by Vyvian Blackthorne

Good goth, you're very welcome :-)


Goth Forever

Aww, thanks. :]

[Breathless Horror]

Originally Posted by Draconysius

I've written a (so far) three-part essay on the goth subculture, starting with its history, moving into my personal beginnings and what it means to be goth, and then speaking of the modern state of goth. If I get enough requests, I'd be happy to post it here for you guys to read. *nudge nudge*

Please post, I'd love to read it!

[biohazard]

Wikipedia has some good info. It was very good to know the history about goth, its actually rather interesting ^^

[IsolatedReptile]

Originally Posted by Draconysius

I've written a (so far) three-part essay on the goth subculture, starting with its history, moving into my personal beginnings and what it means to be goth, and then speaking of the modern state of goth. If I get enough requests, I'd be happy to post it here for you guys to read. *nudge nudge*

I'd be interested.