Far from ground zero, opponents fight new mosques

[CptSternn]

http://tinyurl.com/2g53ta9

MURFREESBORO, Tenn. – Muslims trying to build houses of worship in the nation's heartland, far from the heated fight in New York over plans for a mosque near ground zero, are running into opponents even more hostile and aggressive.

Foes of proposed mosques have deployed dogs to intimidate Muslims holding prayer services and spray painted "Not Welcome" on a construction sign, then later ripped it apart.

The 13-story, $100 million Islamic center that could soon rise two blocks from the site of the Sept. 11 attacks would dwarf the proposals elsewhere, yet the smaller projects in local communities are stoking a sharper kind of fear and anger than has showed up in New York.

In the Nashville suburb of Murfreesboro, opponents of a new Islamic center say they believe the mosque will be more than a place of prayer. They are afraid the 15-acre site that was once farmland will be turned into a terrorist training ground for Muslim militants bent on overthrowing the U.S. government.

"They are not a religion. They are a political, militaristic group," said Bob Shelton, a 76-year-old retiree who lives in the area.

Shelton was among several hundred demonstrators recently who wore "Vote for Jesus" T-shirts and carried signs that said: "No Sharia law for USA!," referring to the Islamic code of law. Others took their opposition further, spray painting the sign announcing the "Future site of the Islamic Center of Murfreesboro" and tearing it up.

In Temecula, Calif., opponents brought dogs to protest a proposed 25,000-square-foot mosque that would sit on four acres next to a Baptist church. Opponents worry it will turn the town into haven for Islamic extremists, but mosque leaders say they are peaceful and just need more room to serve members.

Islam is a growing faith in the U.S., though Muslims represent less than 1 percent of the country's population. Ten years ago, there were about 1,200 mosques nationwide. Now there are roughly 1,900, according to Ihsan Bagby, professor of Islamic Studies at the University of Kentucky and a researcher on surveys of American mosques.

The growth involves Islamic centers expanding to accommodate more Muslims - as is the case in New York, California and Tennessee - as well as mosques cropping up in smaller, more isolated communities, Bagby said.

A 2007 survey of Muslim Americans by the Pew Research Center found that 39 percent of adult Muslims living in the United States were immigrants that had come here since 1990.

"In every religious community, one of the things that has happened over the course of immigration is that people get settled and eventually build something that says, 'We're here! We're not just camping,'" said Diana Eck, a professor of Comparative Religion at the Harvard University. "In part, that's because those communities have put down roots in America and made this their home."

Before the demonstration in Murfreesboro, a fundraiser was held for the new community center. Children behind a folding table sold homemade wooden plaques, door hangers and small serving trays decorated with glitter and messages like, "Peace," "I love being a Muslim" and "Freedom of Religion."

Mosque leader Essam Fathy, who helped plan the new building in Murfreesboro, has lived there for 30 years.

"I didn't think people would try that hard to oppose something that's in the Constitution," he said. "The Islamic center has been here since the early '80s, 12 years in this location. There's nothing different now except it's going to be a little bigger."

Bagby said that hasn't stopped foes from becoming more virulent.

"It was there before, but it didn't have as much traction. The larger public never embraced it," he said. "The level of anger, the level of hostility is much higher in the last few years."

The Murfreesboro mosque is one of three planned in the Nashville area that have drawn recent scrutiny.

Zuhdi Jasser, president of the American Islamic Forum for Democracy, a nonprofit that advocates for reform and modernization of Islam, said opposing mosques is no way to prevent terrorism.

Neighbors didn't want his family to build a mosque in 1979 in Neenah, Wis., because they didn't understand who Muslims were.

"If the Wisconsin mosque had not been allowed to be built, I, at 17, might have put up walls and become a different person," he said. "If we start preventing these from being built, the backlash will be increased radicalization."

A study by professors at the Duke University's Sanford School of Public Policy and the University of North Carolina backs up Jasser's statement. The study found that mosques, religious bookstores and other communal associations that bring Muslim-Americans together helps prevent radicalization.

In Murfreesboro, Imam Ossama Bahloul said the center has hired a security guard for Friday prayer services and a security camera constantly pans the parking lot and doors. Their fears are not without cause.

Two years ago, several men broke into the Islamic Center of Columbia, about 30 miles southwest of Murfreesboro, and torched it with molotov cocktails, stealing a stereo system and painting swastikas and "White Power" on the front of the building.

Bahloul said he hopes the controversy will die down with time. He said the situation has been hardest on the children.

"The second generation is facing a huge challenge because they did not think even for a second before that someone would say, 'You are not welcome.'"

[CptSternn]

The only thing worse than the news is the thousands of racist comments under it. Seriously, this is some outright racist stuff here.

Combined with the fact everyone in this article also supports whats going on in Arizona these days and is against gay marriage, its safe to say America is going all aryan in more ways than one.

There is little left dividing what the right-wing republicans are selling and what those whacko nut jobs in the aryan compounds are these days.

[Ráskógr]

We can never be rid of bigots and their corrupted minds. Bigots breed and produce more bigots. Such is life, and apparently the Grand Neo-Con Party ...

[Alan]

Interesting statistic: A 2005 Pew Global Attitudes Survey showed that the United States is more tolerant of muslims than other important nations.

In the United States, 43% of non-Muslims think that Muslims as a whole are fanatical. That's almost half of the population. It's a "holy shit!" number. How can half of the population be that ignorant of a major religion?

But in Great Britain this percentage is 48%, in France, it's 51%, in Germany it's 78% and in Spain it's 83%

[Raptor]

That sounds really wrong to me, especially over three quarters of Germans and Spanish thinking "Muslims as a whole are fanatical". Where did you get that?


I checked and found this:

http://pewglobal.org/2005/07/14/isla...stern-publics/

Which shows things such as:

Concerns Over Islamic Extremism (in your own country), "Very/Somewhat Concerned"

US 70%
GB 70%
France 73%
Spain 77%
Germany 78%

Those are pulled from the chart near the end of the page. There's a more detailed chart near the beginning which features the same data but broken down into "very" and "somewhat concerned" as separate entries. And it also shows global concern over Islamic extremism. But basically I find it very hard to believe that in the case of Spain for example, if 77% of people have concerns over Islamic extremism that 83% of people also "think that Muslims as a whole are fanatical" as you said.

Or another Pew 2005 page:

http://pewglobal.org/2006/06/22/the-...-each-other/2/

Rating of Muslims, number of people who have a very or somewhat favourable opinion (see top of page in the link, using 2005 numbers)

GB 72%
France 64%
US 57%
Spain 46%
Germany 40%

Again, while Germany and Spain seem to have a majority unfavourable opinion of Muslims, it's still significantly less than than three quarters with that view.

[Raptor]

Damn your stuff was on there after all (near the second of bottom link for anyone interested, it features other negative trait associations too). That surprises me. I think the overall feelings are more positive though. They seem at odds to me.

[Raptor]

That was supposed to say "near the bottom of the second link"...

[Saya]

Muslims are often victims of xenophobia in countries like France, it doesn't surprise me at all. I don't know if there's more Muslim immigrants in European countries than America or Canada but definitely some countries view them as sort of invaders. Wasn't there a city that banned Arab architecture?

[Raptor]

Yeah, minarets.

http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/world/europe/8385069.stm

[Renatus]

As bad as this may be, I'm glad Wisconsin seems to be past such things enough that we have the president of the American Islamic Forum for Democracy living here. Then again maybe we're just crazy here, Neenah even has a song called "where the hell is Neenah. But maybe other places would be better if they were as crazy as us.... well except for all the serial killers we get here.

[Ben Lahnger]

... by Lake Winnebago! ... right next to Menasha!

[OnyxBat]

How could have I'd miss this thread!
Not every body is racist about it even Muslims them selves commented about ground zero, Most New Yorkers just don't get why they are building it in manhattan! Why not build it in queens or Bronx! A mother that lost her kids in 9/11 agreed that they should build it. The Muslims that do agree with it are also trying to show that they are Americans to that do deserve to have free religon like any other american. I myself disagree with the whole thing.
You guys should read NY Times they always have a article about this.

[Saya]

You know its not even a mosque, right? And that there's a mosque four blocks away from Ground Zero thats been there forever, right? And that there's a strip club even closer, right? And that there are shinto shrines at Pearl Harbour, right?

Just so we're clear.

[Fruitbat]

There are fanatics in all religions. They are in the minority and the rest of the people in the religion spend their lives trying to make up for the nut jobs.

We have the same disagreements here about Mosques, usually in areas that have a high Muslim migrant population.

I watched a documentary on Nimbin in northern NSW. It was dairy country, a community of atypical country people (prim and proper). Then the Hippies moved in (60s and 70s), with their free love and drugs. Radical people on both sides were nasty to the others.

It happens all the time.

Anyway I thought that was the cool thing about New York, was that it was a melting pot for people from all over the globe?

[OnyxBat]

Yes Saya I do know that but still two blocks away from were the trade world center use to stand, it hurts, it's like saying "hey why not attack the empire!".
( I've seen that strip club so many times and they always post up half naked women, but that far away from ground zero)
Fruitbat- it is a whole pot full of different races but if you look closely there are part that are mostly singled race. Yeah that the great thing about the apple. I live in a Irish, Italian, Spanish neigborhood.

[Saya]

Dude, no its not. The strip club is the same distance away as the community center will be. The imam in charge is offering the community center as an olive branch. It is on a street with several Arab businesses. IN AN OLD BURLINGTON COAT FACTORY.

You can say you're not saying this out of ignorance, but it is Islamophobic to assume it saying that it advocates a new attack. Jesus Christ.

[OnyxBat]

I thought you were talking about the one in front of Peir 90 I think it's called the Hustlers club.
But that's the thing I am Islamophobic.

[Alan]

How can you admit to being a bigot with such a straight face?

[OnyxBat]

Because then I'll be lying to myself If I don't admit it.

[KontanKarite]

Originally Posted by Alan

How can you admit to being a bigot with such a straight face?

Dude, the bitch admitted it. So you know at least to ignore her. She isn't worth talking to. Ever.

[gothicusmaximus]

I've got something hilarious.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oaQBrTROj2w

You're all welcome.

[Fruitbat]

Originally Posted by gothicusmaximus

I've got something hilarious.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oaQBrTROj2w

You're all welcome.

ROFLOL!! Hilarious indeed!

[OnyxBat]

Originally Posted by gothicusmaximus

I've got something hilarious.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oaQBrTROj2w

You're all welcome.

I saw that video on t.v! My dad threw a fit.

[Ben Lahnger]

It would be funny if so many people weren't taking that video as serious.

I'm very tired of conservative commentators, bloggers and reporters being allowed to get away with smearing people by taking their words out of context. The quote they are running with from Imam Rauf, "U.S. policies were an accessory to the 9/11 crime" was taken from a longer statement when he was describing the CIA behavior in Afghanistan in the 1980's when we were giving money and arms to warlords there in an attempt to drive the Soviets out, thereby funding Osama Bin Laden and helping his establish his power base.

That is absolutely true. My favorite book on the subject is "Ghost Wars: The Secret History of the CIA, Afghanistan, and Bin Laden, from the Soviet Invasion to September 10, 2001" by Steve Coll. Our government's activities in Afghanistan over the last 30 years are a disaster, and WERE a contributing factor to why 9/11 happened.

Imam Rauf probably shouldn't have been the one saying it, but nobody else in the media was saying it.

I saw an interview Sunday with the Imam's wife and the woman who is the head of a nearby Jewish Community Center who is a partner in trying to build this Islamic Community Center (it's not a mosque ... think more like a Muslim equivalent of the YMCA) and they were fabulous. The benefits to the surrounding community would be tremendous. I hope they find a way to get it built despite the ignorance and hate of the protesters.

[Alan]

Originally Posted by Ben Lahnger

Imam Rauf probably shouldn't have been the one saying it, but nobody else in the media was saying it.

Actually someone was saying it: Glenn Beck himself.
He just happens to have a very selective memory.