Need Some Advice.

[Eturnus_Frost]

Ok, forgive me if this thread is in the wrong place.
I'm half out of it, and I'll probably realize what I did wrong as soon as I finish posting this.

I live in Texas, and I'm looking to join the Goth Scene.

To be honest with all of you, I've been dressing of what you'd consider ''Mall Goth''.

Tripps, Band shirt, etc.

Which will be a thing in the past for me very soon.

I really just want your views and opinions of what really makes someone ''Gothic''.

I'm into I guess what some would consider an average stereotypical Goth.

Candles, Velvet, Fishnets, I'm obsessed with dark colors..and have been since I was age 6.

I love the colors: Red, Purple, White, Black.
Many many other colors assisted with Black.

*Exclude White as a dark color*

Graveyards fascinate me, most occult movies, you get the point.


Now for my musical genres:

Any sub genre of Metal, Industrial, Techno, Alternative, Ambient, Classical,
My music taste is widely spread.



I've come to learn a few Gothic Rock bands that I'm ''slowly'' starting to get into.

So far, I'm loving Bauhaus and Sisters Of Mercy.


And for Deathrock so far: Christian Death.


I'm not sure if these others are considered in the Gothic genre but..:

Play Dead,
Londom After Midnight,
The 69 Eyes (I know most don't consider them Gothic, but they got me this far so don't matter to me),

I enjoy some Punk artists, but not enough to make a list of.

You see, most of my friends are narrow minded, and listen to one genre and thats Metal. I did have one friend I considered Gothic, but he had to depart to another state. He was really the only influence I've had, for in my area ''Goths'' are considered if they wear Tripps, and black clothing...which annoys me.

I hope to get obtain some knowledge from some of you.

[Solumina]

we have a lot of thread that should help you find what you want, just browse around (anything threads titled "what is goth" or any variation thereof should work)

[Edward Strange]

To be honest, you arn't doing half bad on your own!

Have a look at this, http://www.goth.net/forums/viewtopic.php?t=6022.
That should give you a reasonably good starting spring board.

Personally, I feel what makes a person a goth is what music they like.
What makes them 'interesting' is everything else!

[korinna5555]

Originally Posted by Edward Strange

Personally, I feel what makes a person a goth is what music they like.
What makes them 'interesting' is everything else!

I TOTALLY agree.

[Eturnus_Frost]

Originally Posted by Edward Strange

To be honest, you arn't doing half bad on your own!

Really?

Thanks everyone for sharing your thoughts

[Eturnus_Frost]

Although I must say something I'm confused about...

I know the Goth Subculture is all about the music..But I kind of thought fashion had its own toll withing the culture as well.

My friend just use to tell me that theres Gothic Fashion, but it doesn't necessarily tie into the ''Goth Subculture'' so I guess that makes sense now.

[MollyMac]

And then there are those of us who think the music is shite and live for the literature. But reading is hard and dressing up is easy.

[da fetus]

you make me fucking sick for not only wanting to algin yourself with such a worthless group of moping deluded elitist idiots, but writing the most long winded page of bile about your jerkoff likes and dislikes. die.

[gothicusmaximus]

Originally Posted by MollyMac

And then there are those of us who think the music is shite and live for the literature.

Isn't 'shite' a little extreme? I mean, I can easily conceive of a goth who prefers gothic literature to goth rock- I myself prefer the written word to music on the whole-but a goth who totally despises the sound which started the scene in the first place? That doesn't seem at all odd to you?
I mean, through extrapolation of your idea we arrive at
"Yeah, I'm a goth, I fucking hate the music and the literature, but I love me some flying buttresses."
or
"Yeah, I'm a goth, I fucking hate the music, the literature, and the architecture, but germanic barbarians get me all hot and bothered."

I don't really care if fans of gothic fiction who hate goth rock want to call themselves goth, this notion just seems a somewhat strange one.

[Godslayer Jillian]

Originally Posted by Eturnus_Frost

My friend just use to tell me that theres Gothic Fashion, but it doesn't necessarily tie into the ''Goth Subculture''

Think of 'gothic fashion' not as one of the pillars of the subculture, but as something bound to happen when a small community begins to form. The only small culture (though counterculture rather than subculture) I've seen that didn't develop it's own look was the Beat generation.
Where in Texas do you live? Most of the Texas gothic scene focuses on Electronic music, from Industrial to EBM.

[Godslayer Jillian]

Originally Posted by gothicusmaximus

"Yeah, I'm a goth, I fucking hate the music and the literature, but I love me some flying buttresses."

I know people like this. They really are just a bunch of posers.
And I don't call them posers just because they're not into gothic rock. I call them posers because they have never heard of Southern Death Cult, they believe the gothic architecture is somehow related to them, and they believe they're members of a chosen few that make up a 'millenarian culture'[sic]

[gothicusmaximus]

Originally Posted by Godslayer Jillian

The only small culture (though counterculture rather than subculture) I've seen that didn't develop it's own look was the Beat generation.

Come on man: http://www.retrogalaxy.com/imgs/bongos-bobble-lg.jpg
They had a look.

[KontanKarite]

Whoever said the music is what makes you a goth and everything else just makes you interesting, I couldn't agree more.

Don't WORRY about what's right or wrong. Just like what you like. If you prefer Industrial to goth, who cares?

Some people are just more rivit than others in musical tastes. *shrugs*

[Godslayer Jillian]

Originally Posted by gothicusmaximus

Come on man: http://www.retrogalaxy.com/imgs/bongos-bobble-lg.jpg
They had a look.

Technically, those were beatnicks. But look at Cassady and his friends, and they were no different looking than any other young adult in those times. I think John Clellon Holmes once described them as just having an aura of individuality or difference; they didn't have to show it.

[Eturnus_Frost]

Originally Posted by Godslayer Jillian

Think of 'gothic fashion' not as one of the pillars of the subculture, but as something bound to happen when a small community begins to form. The only small culture (though counterculture rather than subculture) I've seen that didn't develop it's own look was the Beat generation.
Where in Texas do you live? Most of the Texas gothic scene focuses on Electronic music, from Industrial to EBM.

La Porte, Texas.

[Godslayer Jillian]

So you live near Houston. I have a friend that lived in Houston (or Dallas, I don't know... but I'm pretty sure it was Houston).
He was pretty much a babybat when he was there, but he knew several clubs that played real gothic music, in the electronic part of the spectrum, that is.
Unfortunately we're out of college already, so I won't see him until next semester if you want the name of the club, but it's pretty easy to find them online, I'm just making sure you know you do have a decent goth scene close to you.

[MollyMac]

Originally Posted by gothicusmaximus

Isn't 'shite' a little extreme? I mean, I can easily conceive of a goth who prefers gothic literature to goth rock- I myself prefer the written word to music on the whole-but a goth who totally despises the sound which started the scene in the first place? That doesn't seem at all odd to you?
I mean, through extrapolation of your idea we arrive at
"Yeah, I'm a goth, I fucking hate the music and the literature, but I love me some flying buttresses."
or
"Yeah, I'm a goth, I fucking hate the music, the literature, and the architecture, but germanic barbarians get me all hot and bothered."

I don't really care if fans of gothic fiction who hate goth rock want to call themselves goth, this notion just seems a somewhat strange one.

My opinion of the music is not an extreme, it is an opinion. It is not as if I time-rig the synthesizers to self destruct when the lyrical suckage begins- my hands are simply not that fast. That would be extreme. And fun. But no, the music is shite. My opinion of it does nothing to define me as a person or as part of a genre that seems to be defined solely in defining itself.

Thinking the music is drivel while adoring the lit and architecture makes me gothic as one who loves the music but cares little to read is made to be goth. You wouldn't know a Goth if it ransacked your ass.

There is a difference between goth and gothic and Goth. If you were one of the readers, you'd know that.

[gothicusmaximus]

Originally Posted by MollyMac

My opinion of the music is not an extreme, it is an opinion. It is not as if I time-rig the synthesizers to self destruct when the lyrical suckage begins- my hands are simply not that fast. That would be extreme. And fun. But no, the music is shite. My opinion of it does nothing to define me as a person or as part of a genre that seems to be defined solely in defining itself.

Thinking the music is drivel while adoring the lit and architecture makes me gothic as one who loves the music but cares little to read is made to be goth. You wouldn't know a Goth if it ransacked your ass.

There is a difference between goth and gothic and Goth. If you were one of the readers, you'd know that.

Are you trying to tell me that I don't read gothic literature? Because I do.
In your original post, you said "Those of us who think the music is shit." I assumed that by 'us', you meant goths. I didn't realize that you were asserting that reading gothic fiction made one 'gothic'. By that logic I'm not only gothic, I'm also science, historical and magically realist. Come to think of it, I'm French, Russian, and English too.

[MollyMac]

The original post said "And then there are those of us who think the music is shite and live for the literature."

Breaking it down for clarification: "... and then there are some people who think that Siouxie is an annoyance, but love Percy Blythe"

and yes, by your initial logic- liking goth music makes you goth. I then alleged that liking gothic lit makes you gothic. seems it would fall in line with your way of defining by genre.

And yes, I believe we are more what we study than what we listen to as aural filler.

[gothicusmaximus]

Originally Posted by MollyMac

The original post said "And then there are those of us who think the music is shite and live for the literature."

Breaking it down for clarification: "... and then there are some people who think that Siouxie is an annoyance, but love Percy Blythe"

Oh, this is what caused my confusion. I assumed, since this thread pertains specifically to goths, that by 'us' you meant 'members of the goth subculture', not 'human beings in general. Obviously some people don't like goth rock.

Originally Posted by MollyMac

and yes, by your initial logic- liking goth music makes you goth. I then alleged that liking gothic lit makes you gothic. seems it would fall in line with your way of defining by genre.

And yes, I believe we are more what we study than what we listen to as aural filler.

The difference is that goth is a subculture which formed around gothic rock, like a big club of especially devoted fans who developed their own microcosmic society. One could, theoretically, easily enjoy gothic rock but elect to refrain from taking part in goth, just as one could, theoretically, appreciate Star Trek more than anyone but not choose to attend conventions or otherwise express their passion for their hobby. If readers of gothic literature have developed such a culture, it's certainly not as concretely defined as that founded by fans of goth rock.

I think it's a little silly to contend that only written compositions can be 'studied' and that music is just 'aural filler', as though literature is somehow of greater artistic worth...

[Opteron_Man]

yea, your on the right track Eturnus_Frost. the fact that your music taste is widely spread is a good sign. keep going.

[Tha Duckman]

I think you're pathetic and in need of coaching in "How to live your own life and not be a sell out chud."