Are women biologically programmed to reward cruelty, evil and domination?

[enamdar]

Are women biologically programmed to reward cruelty, evil and domination?
Of course any complaints that girls go for bad boys and jerks instantly labels one a nice guy beta males. To the extent that it is possible, I actually consider myself somewhat of an impartial outside observer. I was an omega jerk in JR and high school, and to an extent my whole psycho personality, worked and I had girls literally chasing me. A lot of it might have been self-delusion but some measures were objective. After that I was in nearly complete isolation in college. So I've never played the role of the bitter nice guy. I have NEVER done anything nice for a girl or anyone my entire life! So I think I have some claim to impartiality, and my position that my deep depression and heart anguish is purely on a metaphysical level.

I read a lot of PUA seduction Game literature. At first my logic was it pays to learn all tools of rhetoric, persuasion and oratory even if I intended to put it to different uses than PUA.

Anyway to put it at its simplest. In cavemen times women were just plaything **** slaves for the strongest ape. And that is what evolutionary psychology in chimpanzee and gorilla behavior proves. Now there might have been some brave women who defended their freedom to the death, but their selfish genes were lost to history. And the genes that all modern women have inherited is those who submit to the cruelest caveman with biggest club.

I don't know for me it is pretty hellish to live in a world where all men are sadists and all women are masochists.

According to PUA science male physical attractiveness barely matters at all, the only thing women find attractive is brute domination and sadism.

For the last year I've completely cut myself off from humanity. Who wants to live in a world of pure evil? Only evil is rewarded! Cruelty is the only virtue. What good is morality and ethics?

So I'd like an outside opinion do you feel that women are biologically programmed to reward cruelty, evil and domination?

Does the dating world going back to the new paleolithic age make life worthless?
Murdoch's theoretical journal which is the official ideology of America and thus the entire world has endorsed the evopsych worldview: The New Dating Game | The Weekly Standard

Now I'm sure no one will believe me, but this is NOT about me being a single virgin loser guy who can't get a date. More its about what kind of world we live in where evil is always rewarded. I can't live in a universe like that. Why bother to get a job and support oneself and live in brutal ruthless dog eat dog world of evil? My parents are going to throw me out in August since I wont get a job or school.

Its true I've always been kind of an anti-sexual puritan but evopsych just makes it more vicious. The Darwinian-Nietzschean struggle for existence means eat or be eaten, kill or be killed, harm or be harmed. I wish simply to neither dominate nor be dominated. But that is far too much to ask in this world on both counts.

I have no harmed anyone, except maybe my parents. My dad says I should be "altrusitic" and recover for my mom's sake.

First off my parents committed a massive injustice on me by bringing me into this cruel world just to satisfy that monster gene- Moloch.

Second them keeping me alive, is just their genes following their selfish interest to reproduce. I represent a major investment in their genes survival. My fall means a major decrease in their genese reproducing. So that is all there is to their so-called generosity to me. The longer they keep me fed, the longer the opportunity there is for me to pass their genes on. Granted thats a pretty miniscule chance for grandkids hiding and crying in the basement, but its higher than the chances if I starved on the street.

So what gratitude should I have to the selfish gene? The "altruism" in feeding and housing me is just the flip side of the selfishness of birthing me into an incredibly hellish universe.

Humanity wants to drive itself off a cliff. I listed my objections. Much wiser men than me have listed them in thick textbooks. Humanity wont listen to the wise men and certainly not to me. So fine. I have said my peace. Let humanity drive off the cliff, but I want no part in the adventure.

I feel nothing for disgust for humanity. But thats what the Darwinian struggle for existence. Brutality is the only virtue. I'm what the Nazis would call life unworthy of life. Even if your content to be a lifelong virgin girls rewarding "bad boy" traits still affects the world you live in. I could not be more repulsed by humanity which is why I have cut myself off in complete isolation for nearly a year now. Would life be better, and free of despair if I saw other humans as unthinking moving objects instead of minds ?

From studying evopsych I have grown deeply disturbed and hateful of humanity. A bunch of sadistic beasts, red in tooth and claw, angling for domination. I wish to never see another human being ever again. I've cut myself off for over a year hiding in the basement till my parents throw me out.

Maybe it be better if I was unaware of humans possessing other minds. If I viewed them as rocks, chairs, hurricanes, viruses. Then I would have no more hate towards victimizers and sympathy towards victims than I hate cancer or a hurricane. Or pity for a dead tree. Just look at humans as moving objects on the landscape.

Would that make things better?

Well in essence this IS about relationships. That is where evolutionary psychology is most obvious in daily life. While it is true I have no human relations, I'm still affected by the sexual stock market, the same way someone who owns no stock can be ruined by a crash.

Psychologists are humans like the rest of us, driven by the reptilian urges for sex and power and domination. There career choice is just there way of gaining domination in the Darwinian game. So I don't see therapists as some elite priestly caste free from evopsych. I don't want to be "fixed" into better being able to play the evolutionary game.

Since everyone here accepts the basic premises of evopsych, I ask how do YOU folks deal with it? Or do you all just accept the game, and try to be the winner? IF thats the case, then maybe your right and there can not be any dialogue between me and humanity.

I don't understand how the rest of humanity can endure such a world and assume its because they must ALL be blood-thirsty vampires themselves.

Although why glorify women as the victims? According to evopsych even when given freedom they will reward cruelty.

So there are no victims in this monstrous world just wolves eating wolves.

How do you endure this world? And what is your advice for me?

What good would having a girlfriend do me? Is the chimpanzee in me supposed to rejoice that as low as I may be in the hierarchy, I still have someone below me who I can hurt, torment, dominate and abuse?


I have no problem being driven out of the sexual marketplace. The problem is what "service" are we competing for? And it seems in the sexual market it is who can be the most brutal and cruel. Evopsych says getting a girlfriend comes down to demonstrating cruelty, domination, brutality, and sadism.


That is all I see in male-female relations and PUa science backs up my personal observations.

[creature6]

Do be quiet.

[KontanKarite]

Ah. It's the nice guy.

[creature6]

http://3.bp.blogspot.com/_H50xpMHArq...0/nice+guy.jpg

How sweet...

[HumanePain]

Enamdar, I found your diatribe quite interesting:

"Second: them keeping me alive, is just their genes following their selfish interest to reproduce. I represent a major investment in their gene's survival. My fall means a major decrease in their genes reproducing. So that is all there is to their so-called generosity to me. The longer they keep me fed, the longer the opportunity there is for me to pass their genes on. Granted that's a pretty minuscule chance for grandkids hiding and crying in the basement, but its higher than the chances if I starved on the street."

There is some truth to this, but because it is true does not lessen the value of any affection they may have for you. You forget parents of gay offspring. They do not love their children any less because they cannot reproduce. There are some parents who disown their children for coming out as gay, but these are the minority.

There are also parents who, for biological reasons, cannot have children and adopt. They are not passing down any genes but love and invest in their adopted children as if they were their own.

Although in the overall scheme of nature, reproduction is an adaptation of humans to their environment (survival of the fittest for the current world), from the individual perspective, it is the relationship with their offspring, the love of a baby, the nurturing and the child's realization of the affection from their parents in return, as unconditional love of a child (and of the parent *for* the child) is intrinsically valuable, and not just because they carry genes.

But in regards to your other observations, yes, the world sucks. It is swimming with sharks, surviving wolf attacks as you describe. As Benjamin Franklin said in Poor Richard's Almanac: "He who knows the world most, likes it least."

[Ben Lahnger]

HumanePain +1

[Solumina]

Hahahaha "PUA science"

[ART]

I don't really know where to begin. Or, yes I do.

See, its one of two things.

Either you are depressed, in which case you need to see a doctor.

If not, you really need to grow a spine. Stop hiding, if you find the world so horrible, go out there and make it just a little bit better!

And no. That women want to be dominated en masse is a load of ... manure. Gender stereotypes like that one is one of the things out there that needs be put right.

And most women certainly do not want sadists. Some do, thankfully, but most decidedly do not. Really.
Having said that, most sadists I know are very decent people. And they are in no way all male.

[Saya]

I should be more politically correct, but what the hell. You are a retard.

While I shouldn't say evolution psychology is total quackery, its something that MUST be taken with grains of salt and cannot exist without the assistance of biology and anthropology. For example, last year a paper was published that men **** because they have "r@pe genes", since rapists would reproduce more. Biologists obviously objected to the idea of "r@pe genes" and also, anthropologists have countered that in primitive societies rapists are shunned by the community, those who ***** are ostracized and so rarely get to pass down their genes. So no, women don't like to be *****. Newsweek has a pretty good article about it:

Or so it seemed. But Hill had something almost as good as a time machine. He had the Ache, who live much as humans did 100,000 years ago. He and two colleagues therefore calculated how **** would affect the evolutionary prospects of a 25-year-old Ache. (They didn't observe any rapes, but did a what-if calculation based on measurements of, for instance, the odds that a woman is able to conceive on any given day.) The scientists were generous to the ****-as-adaptation claim, assuming that rapists target only women of reproductive age, for instance, even though in reality girls younger than 10 and women over 60 are often victims. Then they calculated ****'s fitness costs and benefits. **** costs a man fitness points if the victim's husband or other relatives kill him, for instance. He loses fitness points, too, if the mother refuses to raise a child of ****, and if being a known rapist (in a small hunter-gatherer tribe, **** and rapists are public knowledge) makes others less likely to help him find food. **** increases a man's evolutionary fitness based on the chance that a **** victim is fertile (15 percent), that she will conceive (a 7 percent chance), that she will not miscarry (90 percent) and that she will not let the baby die even though it is the child of **** (90 percent). Hill then ran the numbers on the reproductive costs and benefits of ****. It wasn't even close: the cost exceeds the benefit by a factor of 10. "That makes the likelihood that **** is an evolved adaptation extremely low," says Hill. "It just wouldn't have made sense for men in the Pleistocene to use **** as a reproductive strategy, so the argument that it's preprogrammed into us doesn't hold up."

In Susan Faludi's book Backlash, while the data may be old she found statistics showed that women were generally happier single than married, and a vast majority of women prefer to work than depend on a spouse. Men however were generally unhappy single. That said, women's emancipation isn't all that new, we're still adjusting our gender roles to eliminate the idea that women are passive and men are aggressive and dominating. You're not helping the process.

[JCC]

What a load of absolute fucking nonsense.

[vindicatedxjin]

I'm really not the type to lower myself to violence. But if I ever met this guy. I would probably stab him.

[creature6]

well it's a common thing to find on certain threads at the moment.
Nonsense seems to be in fashion.

[DRM]

This is totally true, I mean when I see a guy kicking a puppy or something, whoo do I get hot and horny.

(I'm joking)

[Despanan]

Originally Posted by enamdar

Blahbbity blah blah

Looks like someone has Aspergers, (or puts way too much effort into trolling).

[Ben Lahnger]

ART +1
Saya +1
JCC +1
Despanan +5 (... or both)

[enamdar]

Look I don't WANT to believe this is true. And its not about my personal life, but the type of world I have to live in.

If its not true, tell me. But why does pop culture and dominant science and ideology say it is true? Why is it what I THINK I saw personally? What have you seen in your lives?

How can people be so ok with living in a world where any act of love, kindness, caring, gentleness, warmth, is a show of weakness?

I am agnostic to whether or not PUA science is objectively true. Certainly there is strong empirical evidence that it is not. But what is truth? Evopsych is the dominant ideology in America, and the US rules the world. Power creates its own truth. Evopsych may very well end up in the dustbin of history. But I see no seeds of this development or a challenge, and if it is going to be True for my lifetime, then in that most important sense it IS true.

Well first off, evopsych is an ideology that claims to explain all life on earth, including human society and interactions. All of my points on the cruelties of existence comes from the world-view created by sociobiology. So if evopsych is true, the rest of my problems follow. Other than PUAs few people consciously live by evopsych, but a lot has seeped into popular culture, but evopsych claims to explain how people act unconsciously. Its definitely not about psychologists ruling the world. But the people who DO rule the world are simply the executors of the ideology.

Humans are just robots genes used to reproduce. Evolution has not changed human nature much in the last ten thousand years. So we still have a brutal caveman mind in our skulls.

[Despanan]

Okay, I am now 100% sure this is a troll.

[ART]

Well. If it is a troll, which I too now find likely, I'll gladly hand out a gold star for effort!

[enamdar]

Isn't calling people trolls just a way of de-legitimizing the range of conversations? By calling me a troll are you saying that no real person could suffer from the pain of seeing cruelty rewarded? If I had written I used to be a nice guy, but now I realize girls want jerks, that would be very "normal", you hear that all the time. But because I was never a nice guy and don't want to be a jerk but simply am pained by the cruelty, I can't be genuine? This would be a weird problem to make up.

[Malice In Wonderland]

Originally Posted by enamdar

Look I don't WANT to believe this is true. And its not about my personal life, but the type of world I have to live in.

If its not true, tell me. But why does pop culture and dominant science and ideology say it is true? Why is it what I THINK I saw personally? What have you seen in your lives?

How can people be so ok with living in a world where any act of love, kindness, caring, gentleness, warmth, is a show of weakness?

I am agnostic to whether or not PUA science is objectively true. Certainly there is strong empirical evidence that it is not. But what is truth? Evopsych is the dominant ideology in America, and the US rules the world. Power creates its own truth. Evopsych may very well end up in the dustbin of history. But I see no seeds of this development or a challenge, and if it is going to be True for my lifetime, then in that most important sense it IS true.

Well first off, evopsych is an ideology that claims to explain all life on earth, including human society and interactions. All of my points on the cruelties of existence comes from the world-view created by sociobiology. So if evopsych is true, the rest of my problems follow. Other than PUAs few people consciously live by evopsych, but a lot has seeped into popular culture, but evopsych claims to explain how people act unconsciously. Its definitely not about psychologists ruling the world. But the people who DO rule the world are simply the executors of the ideology.

Humans are just robots genes used to reproduce. Evolution has not changed human nature much in the last ten thousand years. So we still have a brutal caveman mind in our skulls.

Hey you, didn't Saya just tell everything you said to fuck off?

[ART]

You can be genuine, enamdar. It is just not likely you are.

But, since I have nothing better to do with these minutes, I'll give you the benefit of the doubt.

It is very simple advice, really.

First, make friends. Hang out with people. Why? Because isolation is the only fertile ground for the strange ideas that haunt you.
Second, do see a doctor. An undiagnosed depression isn't a good thing. To paraphrase the old saying, better safe than very very sad.
Third. Talk to your parents. Make amends. You only ever get one set of parents.

[Ben Lahnger]

enamdar, you are either a troll, or a guy who's obsessed with what it takes to get a woman's affection to an unhealthy degree. If you had started just a simple intellectual conversation it might be a different matter, but there is so much emotion, need and frustration attached to your words that troll or over-obsession are the only two possibilities.

I don't want to feed a troll (and if you are a troll then you'll find some way to come back with a response guaranteed to stir the pot further no matter what anyone says to you), but if you are serious I have the following advice:

Good guy or bad guy, not many women are attracted to guys who are desperate. You do not sound like a guy any woman I know would want to spend any time with. You kinda sound like a guy saying, "Why don't the kiddies want to get into my car? I've got plenty of candy. What, do I have to do what the other creeps do and just snatch them off the sidewalk?" You are too needy in a way that has corrupted you whole thinking. I do think you probably need counseling ... unless you are a troll.

Stop worrying about what behavior will make you most likely to be attractive to women, and start thinking about what behavior will make you a happy, healthy, productive member of society. All good things will come to you as a result of that pursuit in the end.

And stop talking about any group of people with those broad generalizations. It's just wrong.

[enamdar]

I made very clear in my OP, that this wasn't about me personally wanting a girlfriend. It is about what kind of world we live in, in which evil is what is rewarded. Since the reproduction of the gene is the ultimate drive for behavior, the sexual marketplace is the most obvious example, but it affects all aspects of life.

So if your saying I'm a troll because no real person could be this needy or desperate, as I said in my OP I would be fine to be a lifelong virgin, that isn't the issue.

So to be very clear what makes me miserable is not my personal life but the nature of existence and the Darwinian struggle for existence.

ARE you really ok with living in a world where the word "nice" is an insult? Where hurting a girl is sexy and strong but showing her kindness and love is unmanly and weak?

Now look I admit that I may have overreacted. I was somewhat of a puritan prude when I started college, so I saw all sexuality as about domination and submission. And the PUA lit I read just confirmed it. Perhaps cutting myself off was an overreaction. But then inertia sets in, and its hard to restart life once your cut off. Thats why I'm reaching out on this forum. I want to know what YOU think. Is the whole nice guys finish last thing a myth? Is my perception all wrong? Thats all I want to know. Is the world as bad as I said it was? I guess my follow-up is if the world really is that bad how do you live with it?

If I told you all the details of my real life, you would be sure I was a troll because no real person could be that self-depreciating and pathetic. But this isn't about my personal issues. Think of it as abstract philosophy. Is the world bad and if it is how and why, do you deal with it?

[Despanan]

So if your saying I'm a troll because no real person could be this needy or desperate, as I said in my OP I would be fine to be a lifelong virgin, that isn't the issue.

Actually, I believe you are a troll not because you come across like an Aspie (that's common enough for gnet) but because of your responses to our criticism of your post. You have not introduced yourself, nor have you posted in any threads other than this one.

When Saya disproved your psuedo science with actual science you didn't address it, you ignored it, and when it was brought up again you also ignored it and continued to restate your original point, making certain to leave the thread open and prompt replies.

A real woman-hating mysanthropic Aspie, would be emotionally invested in his argument, and would work to defend his position and himself. This is not what you have done, you just continue to restate your OP a priori.

You also leave yourself open for personal attacks by drawing attention to stereotypical character flaws (such as being a basement-dwelling unemployed virgin) hoping that this information will prompt us to take the bait and start flaming the shit out of you. Unsubtle, but "A" for effort. You need to learn to embody your character a bit more.

Your profile is also massively incomplete. If you want to be more effective, put some time into that instead of making such a big honkin' first post.

Take it from one who knows:

Obvious Troll is Obvious

[Ben Lahnger]

One, I disagree with your premise entirely. Just like with men, there are a significant number of women who make bad choices. That has nothing to do with genetics at this point and everything to do with how they are raised. But there are plenty of women who like to be with nice guys. Those are the only ones I choose to date and I can attest to the fact that there is no shortage of them in any age category.

Two, there are a lot of guys who have serious issues with depression and feeling isolated. One constant among them is to construct elaborate fictions about why other people don't like them, when the truth is they make little effort to be likable. Who wants to hang out with someone who is "self-depreciating and pathetic." Get counseling.

Third, each of your posts further convinces me that you are both a troll and a young man who is deeply in need of mental health support. You label yourself as "self-depreciating and pathetic" yet propose that the problem is with approximately 50% of the human race. QED: TROLL and MENTAL HEALTH ISSUE.

Get help.