Gothic.net News Horror Gothic Lifestyle Fiction Movies Books and Literature Dark TV VIP Horror Professionals Professional Writing Tips Links Gothic Forum




Go Back   Gothic.net Community > Boards > Politics

Politics "Under democracy, one party always devotes its chief energies to trying to prove that the other party is unfit to rule -and both commonly succeed, and are right." -H.L. Menken

Reply
 
Thread Tools Search this Thread
Old 04-19-2005, 08:40 PM   #1
MrMaelstrom
 
MrMaelstrom's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2003
Location: Lisboa, Portugal
Posts: 1,608
New Pope

A german conservative is the Roman Catholic Church's new Pope (human representation of that organization's deity on planet Earth).

Now, if for one, I applaud the church's decision not to suck politically correct dick (the much hyped possibility of a new pope to be of african, south-american or asian ethnicity).
Well, the new pope belongs to an ethnicity that does not represent the reasons why others were talked about (diversity or affirmative action, if you will).

My concern is not whether the man is german, my concern is that he is a conservative, and, no matter how much JP the IInd influenced the crumbling of the Iron Curtain in his day, the church faces a lot different challenges today. These challenges would be better met by someone who knows personally the tragedy of Africa's constant losing war on disease, famine and ignorance; or the tragedy of South america's intolerance and corruption; or Asia's overpopulation, poverty and STD problems.
Someone who knows first-hand the need to change the mind of the church and its followers about the importance and need of:

-Tolerance and respect.

-Sustainable development.

-Birth Control.

-Child-planning and care to populations.


Enough to get you going?
__________________
Undead again...
MrMaelstrom is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-20-2005, 08:47 AM   #2
TeapotScar
 
TeapotScar's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2004
Posts: 1,111
I feel similarly to you, Mael. An uber-conservative isn't going to be a good mediator in inter-faith dialogue, or dialogue amongst Christians. He's not going to help the church change with the world, more likely he'll put the church *against* the world. Not what we need.
I know Pope Benedict left "Hitler's Youth" in 1945, but the fact that he belonged to such a group says something about Pope Benedict's person.
He dismisses same-sex couples as "deviant and evil", which won't help with the dialogue between gays and straights... as if this is much of a change, but seriously- we could have hoped for a little bit more than an ex-Nazi.

Another interesting tidbit about the new Pope- he was nick-named "God's Rottweiler".

Quote:
According to Conservative Newspaper, Radical Backward-Thinking Theologian Once Called The Enlightenment "A Thorn in Our [The Church's] Side"; Also, Called Protestant Churches "Deficient," Homosexuality a "Disorder," and Said That Humans Have "No Conceivable Right" to Gay Sex Between Consenting Adults; Of Hate Crimes Legislation, Said That "Neither the Church Nor Society at Large Should Be Surprised" When Such Legislation Causes "Violent Reactions [Against Gays to] Increase"
(from here)

Someone who's already stating such strong, aggressive possitions on the main issues that the Catholic Church needs to have discussion on... it's not a good start. It's one thing to have an opinion, it's quite another to condemn those who you should have dialogue with. Right now, we need a pope who will listen, who will understand...

I'm not asking for a liberal pope, because I know that's impossible, but maybe just a guy who doesn't walk in, first day on the job, and say "You are all DEMONS....but I'm open to dialogue." He's Catholic, it's pretty much given he's not pro-Protestants/Gays, etc. He doesn't need to condemn them immediately, especially when most newspapers are reporting that his major goals are "the promotion of the unity of Christians and a commitment to ecumenism, the continued dialogue with other religions and the fulfillment of the reforms of the Second Vatican Council." (from the New York Times).

Disclaimer: Before any of you dismiss me as the anti-Christ, I'll have you know I was a Sunday School teacher at a Presbyterian Church, and after work I went directly to Catholic Mass, which was held in the same church. I know my theology, and I know where I stand on religion. I'm not baptized, I never took the eucharist, but I have a deep respect for religion and its implications to my life, to everybody's life, to the world.
__________________
Study math.

-Add me on myspace, because I'm pretty sure I've tried to add you! http://www.myspace.com/fermeztesyeux
TeapotScar is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-20-2005, 09:55 AM   #3
WolfMoon
 
WolfMoon's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2003
Location: I own Pitseleh!!
Posts: 3,748
It's just bad news.

Why did JP II have to die and leave everything in the hands of someone like this Ratzinger?

I haven't given up my pagan ways, but I was sad when I heard the new Pope's pronouncements on being elected.Plus I don't like the look in his eyes.But that's just me.JP never looked shifty like he does.

This new guy's going to be nothing but trouble.I see him breeding nothing but dis-unity and dis-harmony in the future.
WolfMoon is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-20-2005, 10:30 AM   #4
CptSternn
 
CptSternn's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2003
Location: Co. Clare, Ireland
Posts: 4,587
My mate emailed me and told me at first how confused and excited he was that John Ratzberger was now the pope! Then he saw it wasn't John after all, and alas was depressed.

But wouldn't Cliff make a good Pope?

To early to tell what this guy will do. Ye never know...


SlŠn
CptSternn is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-20-2005, 10:53 PM   #5
Empty_Purple_Stars
 
Empty_Purple_Stars's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2004
Location: Right Here
Posts: 3,445
Re: New Pope

Quote:
Originally Posted by MrMaelstrom

-Birth Control.

-Child-planning and care to populations.

The hope I had of the above things ^^ actually changing for the better were certainly blown to smithereens..

So South American women will remain doomed with one of the highest birth rate in the world, and one of the highest mortality rate's for women 35 and under, until this guy wheezes his last breath..

That has been my big problem with the Vatican, they have been so anti-birth control, and anti-family planning for so many years, which doesn't seem all that bad on the surface..

But when you look at Honduras and Guatemala, you see the problem..

These families are suffering terribly, with children they cant afford to care for, let alone feed. All because the Vatican says Birth Control is evil.

My surgeon volunteers 2 months in Guatemala every year with a team of doctors, and the stories she has told me are so horrendous.

Women walking three days just to see them for care, with prolapsed uteruses hanging down their legs, from bearing so many children.

They give birth again and again and again until their bodies give out, and then they die...

It's fucking criminal, and the Vatican just turns a blind eye to it all..

Yeah, gee that must be God's master plan..

Its fucking brilliant though, because the people believe they risk eternal damnation by defying God and using birth control to prevent unwanted pregnancies..

Control by intimidation.

Ring any bells?

Makes me ill..

And now with Ratzinger, things in my opinion will only get worse, not better..

And who suffers?

Millions of good people and their children, all because of someone outdated religious edict that has no place in todays world, in my opinion.

Argh, I'll get off my soapbox, it is just so disheartening to stand by and watch, like so many other things..

Makes me feel oh so much better as well knowing that Ratzinger was a member of Hitler's youth.

Whee=Not so much

:x :cry:
Empty_Purple_Stars is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-21-2005, 06:40 AM   #6
CptSternn
 
CptSternn's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2003
Location: Co. Clare, Ireland
Posts: 4,587
Like the lads are saying down at the shop - get three more coffins ready!
CptSternn is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-21-2005, 09:23 AM   #7
WolfMoon
 
WolfMoon's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2003
Location: I own Pitseleh!!
Posts: 3,748
Quote:
Originally Posted by CptSternn
My mate emailed me and told me at first how confused and excited he was that John Ratzberger was now the pope! Then he saw it wasn't John after all, and alas was depressed.

But wouldn't Cliff make a good Pope?

To early to tell what this guy will do. Ye never know...


SlŠn
Uh, Joseph Ratzinger, babe.
WolfMoon is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-21-2005, 03:07 PM   #8
Asurai
 
Join Date: Nov 2003
Posts: 324
Quote:
Originally Posted by TeapotScar
I know Pope Benedict left "Hitler's Youth" in 1945, but the fact that he belonged to such a group says something about Pope Benedict's person.

...we could have hoped for a little bit more than an ex-Nazi.
I've had a very interesting talk with a man, probably in his '80s, who fought in the German Army under Hitler. Getting tired of being called a nazi, he would always respond: "The nazis were a political party. I was <i>drafted</i> into the German Army."

It's basically the same thing. If you were a teenager in Germany during the early '40s, you were more-or-less automatically in the Hitler Youth, whether you liked it or not.
Asurai is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-21-2005, 06:39 PM   #9
TeapotScar
 
TeapotScar's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2004
Posts: 1,111
Quote:
Originally Posted by Asurai
Quote:
Originally Posted by TeapotScar
I know Pope Benedict left "Hitler's Youth" in 1945, but the fact that he belonged to such a group says something about Pope Benedict's person.

...we could have hoped for a little bit more than an ex-Nazi.
I've had a very interesting talk with a man, probably in his '80s, who fought in the German Army under Hitler. Getting tired of being called a nazi, he would always respond: "The nazis were a political party. I was drafted into the German Army."

It's basically the same thing. If you were a teenager in Germany during the early '40s, you were more-or-less automatically in the Hitler Youth, whether you liked it or not.
Haha, it's good to have you back, Asurai.

You're right- he's not a Nazi.

Quote:
Ratzinger joined the Hitler Youth aged 14, shortly after membership was made compulsory in 1941. He soon won a dispensation on account of his training at a seminary. "Ratzinger was only briefly a member of the Hitler Youth and not an enthusiastic one," said John Allen, his biographer.
From here.
However, from the same link:
Quote:
"Resistance was truly impossible," Georg Ratzinger [the pope's brother] said. "Before we were conscripted, one of our teachers said we should fight and become heroic Nazis and another told us not to worry, as only one soldier in a thousand was killed. But neither of us ever used a rifle against the enemy."

Some locals in Traunstein, such as Elizabeth Lohner, 84, whose brother-in-law was sent to Dachau as a conscientious objector, dismiss such suggestions. "It was possible to resist, and those people set an example for others," she said. "The Ratzingers were young and they had made a different choice."
So who's to say... He's a controversial figure, there's no arguing that. He's released many statments that make critics angry, especially statements about other faiths, and how Catholics are the only people guaranteed eternal salvation, and how Buddhism is an "auto-erotic" spirituality... This is the man who's main plan is to open inter-faith talks... I don't trust him.
__________________
Study math.

-Add me on myspace, because I'm pretty sure I've tried to add you! http://www.myspace.com/fermeztesyeux
TeapotScar is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-22-2005, 03:42 PM   #10
Asurai
 
Join Date: Nov 2003
Posts: 324
Quote:
Originally Posted by TeapotScar
Haha, it's good to have you back, Asurai.

You're right- he's not a Nazi.
:shock: Well, that's not the welcome that I expected from you. But it is appreciated.

Quote:
This is the man who's main plan is to open inter-faith talks... I don't trust him.
That line is basically political bullshit to get elected. With whom is he going to open inter-faith talks? Protestant Christians would probably be mostly civil, but they're almost alone. Reform Jews would show up, but not the Orthodox, and any talk with Jews that doesn't involve them is basically a sham. Islam would probably join the talks on condition that the Pope apologize for the crusades and make a dozen other concessions that will never be made. A few open Muslims would likely be interested in talks, but, as with the Jews, it would be a sham to include them without their traditionalists.

Buddhists are cool, though. But I don't see much being accomplished by an inter-faith dialogue between Buddhists and the Vatican.

As I said, the "inter-faith talks" line is to the Papacy the equivalent of our American "I will improve education." A few half-handed attempts will be made, then it's on to business as usual.
Asurai is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-22-2005, 09:17 PM   #11
Loy
 
Loy's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2004
Location: Seattle
Posts: 408
Asurai-considering that every pope since Blessed John XXIII has had inter-faith communication of all kinds with religious heads of all stripes, and said heads have had no qualms about coming to the table or discussing/debating differences and similarities, and both sides have walked away at peace with each other, your statement suggesting that something like this could never happen seems a bit....well, absurd.

....as far as the new pope thing is concerned, all I can think is "wow....another religious head I won't pay attention to". I mean, c'mon people, how many of you are A-catholic, B-PRACTICING catholic, and C-actually affected by this guys stance on these things? I mean, yeah, it would have been nice to have another Blessed John XXIII (who, by the way, pissed off a lot of the church during his papacy by trying to find a common ground between church dogma and modern life.....something to point out whenever people pull the "popes don't wanna modernise the church), but catholics have this guy....ho hum.
__________________
I don't mean to sound bitter, cold, or cruel, but I am, so that's how it comes out.
Loy is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-22-2005, 09:59 PM   #12
Morpheus_Noctifer
 
Morpheus_Noctifer's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2003
Location: Baton Rouge, LA
Posts: 121
Well, I don't know this new pope personally, so I can speak only on what I've heard, which is not usually advisable. So, I'll simply say that I'll judge tihs new pope by his actions.

I'm not Catholic; hell, I'm very much pagan, but I did respect JP jr., simply because he carried himself as a man of honor. He believed what he believed, and didn't profess to something simply because it was in his best interests in obtaining more power and influence in the church. He seemed to genuinely care about people, and I do pray that Benedict XVI is a man of similar convictions and compassion - especially in reaching out to others and trying to work with those of different faiths.

And he looks like a nice enough old man...but...book covers don't tell much of anything, do they? And most of them today promise more than the text delivers.

Anyway, in pace requiescas, Johannem Paulum II.

Damn, no more posting after a few snifters of brandy...good brany though.
Morpheus_Noctifer is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-24-2005, 10:23 AM   #13
WolfMoon
 
WolfMoon's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2003
Location: I own Pitseleh!!
Posts: 3,748
Quote:
Originally Posted by Loy
Asurai-considering that every pope since Blessed John XXIII has had inter-faith communication of all kinds with religious heads of all stripes, and said heads have had no qualms about coming to the table or discussing/debating differences and similarities, and both sides have walked away at peace with each other, your statement suggesting that something like this could never happen seems a bit....well, absurd.

....as far as the new pope thing is concerned, all I can think is "wow....another religious head I won't pay attention to". I mean, c'mon people, how many of you are A-catholic, B-PRACTICING catholic, and C-actually affected by this guys stance on these things? I mean, yeah, it would have been nice to have another Blessed John XXIII (who, by the way, pissed off a lot of the church during his papacy by trying to find a common ground between church dogma and modern life.....something to point out whenever people pull the "popes don't wanna modernise the church), but catholics have this guy....ho hum.
Actually, if he is as intolerant as he sounds he'll spread that to those that see him as some supreme being.Those people are the ones that we see every day.I don't think the man himself could have any effect on me, personally.But I live in an area(now) that's heavily populated with catholics, so if they take his teachings to heart then, yes, that affects me.

If he teaches that gays are evil or demonic, that affects the members of the gay community, re:gay-bashing is okay cuz the pope says they're evil/demonic.

If he tells people that catholicism is the only righteous path that will have an affect on those of us not catholic in some way or another.

I'm reminded of a metaphor about a moth's wings on one side of the world creating a tornado or something on the other side. :?
WolfMoon is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-24-2005, 11:39 AM   #14
Jane13
 
Jane13's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2004
Posts: 1,051
The new pope just doesn't seem to have the same sense of humanity about him that John Paul had. I know he had issues with gay people (with which I don't agree), but I think it was a major step to actually say that being predudiced against Jewish people is a sin. I don't really know about what I think of the new pope yet...
__________________
"There's straw in his brains and his clothing is stained with mice and small newts and the perfectly maimed. Don't look under his hood in the place where he stood or you'll find yourself running from the rook in the wood."
-Cinema Strange
Jane13 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-24-2005, 09:24 PM   #15
GothHyena
 
Join Date: Mar 2004
Location: Off my rocker and being beaten with it
Posts: 30
My mom thinks he looks kind of wierd.
GothHyena is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-24-2005, 10:05 PM   #16
AlKilyu
 
AlKilyu's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2004
Posts: 2,130
What is your Pope name?
AlKilyu is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-24-2005, 10:44 PM   #17
TeapotScar
 
TeapotScar's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2004
Posts: 1,111
I'm Pope Offensive Randy XI. Heh..

And I agree with Jane whole-heartedly. Well said.
__________________
Study math.

-Add me on myspace, because I'm pretty sure I've tried to add you! http://www.myspace.com/fermeztesyeux
TeapotScar is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-25-2005, 12:00 PM   #18
WolfMoon
 
WolfMoon's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2003
Location: I own Pitseleh!!
Posts: 3,748
Pope Hideous Doug X

:lol:
WolfMoon is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-25-2005, 02:22 PM   #19
edible_eye
 
edible_eye's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2004
Posts: 3,795
i'm pope vicious ralph the 8th.

and it's funny to me, in a curious way, how much furor has arisen over catholics electing a catholic pope.
__________________
"How many times can I say I'm not sorry? And how many ways can I show I don't care?" - Type O Negative
edible_eye is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-25-2005, 05:00 PM   #20
Jane13
 
Jane13's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2004
Posts: 1,051
This sort of thing always happens to me in these name-genorators.....
Pope Facetious Dick II . Also, I think the new pope looks a little like "Rotwang; The Invemtor" from "Metropolis". Maybe I'm nuts.


http://oomu.org/documents/images/metropolis/rotwang.jpg
__________________
"There's straw in his brains and his clothing is stained with mice and small newts and the perfectly maimed. Don't look under his hood in the place where he stood or you'll find yourself running from the rook in the wood."
-Cinema Strange
Jane13 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-26-2005, 05:40 AM   #21
skoteinh
 
skoteinh's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2004
Location: Athens, Greece
Posts: 669
I'm Pope Atrocious Phil IX!

and I decree that drooling on forums is a sin!

:P
__________________
Pain is inevitable. Suffering is optional.
skoteinh is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-26-2005, 07:25 AM   #22
edible_eye
 
edible_eye's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2004
Posts: 3,795
Quote:
Originally Posted by skoteinh
I'm Pope Atrocious Phil IX!

and I decree that drooling on forums is a sin!

:P
i, pope vicious ralph the 8th, contest that decree. now, post some pics of your luscious self, pope atrocious phil IX so i can commence my drooling.
__________________
"How many times can I say I'm not sorry? And how many ways can I show I don't care?" - Type O Negative
edible_eye is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-26-2005, 07:38 AM   #23
skoteinh
 
skoteinh's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2004
Location: Athens, Greece
Posts: 669
To quote your signature, Pope Vicious Ralph the 8th, "Not every thirst should be slaked"

:twisted:
__________________
Pain is inevitable. Suffering is optional.
skoteinh is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-26-2005, 07:43 AM   #24
edible_eye
 
edible_eye's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2004
Posts: 3,795
__________________
"How many times can I say I'm not sorry? And how many ways can I show I don't care?" - Type O Negative
edible_eye is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-26-2005, 06:50 PM   #25
AlKilyu
 
AlKilyu's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2004
Posts: 2,130
AlKilyu is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply

Bookmarks

Thread Tools Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

Advanced Search

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off


Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
Sex shop to give away Pope condoms Saya Spooky News 14 05-23-2010 12:37 AM
Pope deplores... Random Havoc Spooky News 12 02-14-2010 09:07 PM
Woman tackles pope Alan Spooky News 6 12-29-2009 09:08 AM
.: Randomness :. Perfectly_Flawed General 24061 03-15-2009 01:09 PM
New Joke thread Solumina General 245 04-22-2007 12:28 PM


All times are GMT -7. The time now is 06:50 PM.